Hail To Thee Fat Person!

LOL this one is kind of funny, if only we had something like this on TV today...

Relationships and Supersized Ladies

I had an interesting conversation on this blog article.

"Guys Who Like Fat Chicks"

Scroll down to the comments and see what I had to say to a fat admirer writing in.

Here is a segment:

"I just don't think telling superfat women they have to "settle" is an answer.

Yes, being superfat may even preclude the relationship due to functionality issues to start.

But don't superfat people deserve real LOVE too where the WHOLE PERSON is embraced?

Yes I have had people come up to me in shock, that my husband married me. By the way, his family banned the wedding. Some people told him to his face he was nuts. I have been told I have married "out of my league" even based on his looks. {yes seriously}

 And marriage takes work, but if you are going to have a FETISH skewing it all at the start how successful will it be?"

Too many fat women especially in stratosphere sizes are told they have to "take what they can get". I would fathom it is better to be alone, then to be with someone who has made a fetish out of you. One thing I do know dating can be far harder for those in the extreme sizes, I am not talking just mid-sized fat people but women in the 400plus weight ranges. Many people I know in my weight ranges do not marry, or date at all, some of this is due to the limitations of functionality but also social realities. I dated very late myself.

I'll be honest, when I was in the size acceptance world, I saw many dysfunctional relationships where it seemed to me that very fat women were more prone to ending up with extremely predatory men and ones of dubious moral and other characters. I saw horrible stuff from the sides. Some of the women, were with men who told them because they were very fat, they had to put up with them sleeping with other women and I saw women who took this! There were the abusers and other horrible men. Some treated their very plus sized partners with a disdain, and like they were DOING THEM A FAVOR. If you end up with a man like that run, RUN!

I had this terrible experience of once telling this 400lb+ lady I knew in size acceptance social circles, "You are too desperate to get married, you could end up with an abuser or worse". What happened to her, as I found out a couple years after moving away, was beyond horrible as she lost her life to the worse kind of man. I still shudder thinking about that.

Many superfat women lowered their boundaries to get what they could get, and I noticed in the FA [fat admirer] playground world of size acceptance society, that the FAs I found myself in contact with and turning down because I was already engaged, didn't seem to hold to even normative standards of monogamy and morality. In other words, the numbers of "players" seemed to outdistance, the number of normal guys looking for a wife or girlfriend. As I have written before, I became a Christian later but was conservative enough back then to be horrified.

This can happen to ALL women, but I think anyone facing disabilities and super-obesity they are more at risk. One good friend of mine, now deceased used to tell me "broken" people attract other "broken" people. While some of us may be able to find long-time relationships, and I am not saying even those relationships are trouble free-be married over 10 years and many issues will crop up, super-fat women especially need to be careful out there.

Sometimes with us super-fat women, we have to draw our lines stronger, and even as a relationship develops even years later, make sure to hold to our boundaries. When my husband lost his jobs, and we saw the bottom fall out, a few years back, it put incredible strain on us. I had to face some of my own what the pyschological world would call "co-dependent" behavior and even in my own marriage, make it clear there was expectations that were going to be held up. Things are going well now, but relationships in general take work especially when you are getting close to the 15-20 year mark. If you pair up with someone who is into the "fetish" of fat, I dare say the odds are lesser for a long term commitment. I also question how many of those free-willing fat fetish types hold to old school beliefs regarding marriage, dating or relating?

However remembering what I have seen in the size acceptance world and seeing what other fat women have encountered in the regular dating world unless a super-fat woman has very good support systems and has developed extraordinary confidence, the dating and relationship world is full of more minefields then even for a normal woman. Women can be in danger in looking for relationships to fulfill way too many needs. One person can not hand you self fulfilment on a platter. I believe one cannot get their needs met from one human being even if all the romantic songs tell us otherwise and one should be looking to God first. Others still, having faced a hateful society and endless rejection, some from their own families even, put all their chickens in one basket which can leave them very vulnerable to the wolves of the world out there skulking around to see who they can devour.

So for women who are superfat and in the very high sizes, if you desire to date or marry, you need to be careful. If you choose not to date, that is understandable too because of the other factors including functionality. You have to look at what the other person can handle and make sure they are going into the relationship with their eyes open regarding fertility, health, disability and financial issues. When I married, we did not expect me to live very long. I had already told by the doctors unless I lost weight, and there was already mutterings about my thyroid caused cardiomyopathy, that I would be dead very soon, and I was in and out of the hospital constantly back then with my weight near 700lbs. Maybe I was young and romantic and foolish, to get married at such a huge size, and even years later told my husband maybe it wasn't fair to you, and wondered it then but he has told me I've given him years of happiness despite the hardships and would not change a thing.

So I know women my size can meet someone who does love them, but there is serious dangers out there in the dating world. Other women who face other disabilities, and my husband has to deal with my eroding hearing, also can be more vulnerable. I think I saw too much with those other fat women. As I have written about on this blog many times, even seeing how some super fat women were lured into pornography in size acceptance breaks my heart to this day. This included women in the 600lb plus weight range, being told this exploitation would bring them acceptance. The wolves of the world like to manipulate the suffering.

Anyhow the superfat woman needs to be very careful out there. You may if you decide to date, realize you have to look for something deeper beyond the "meat market". From my own personal opinion that is where your best options lie, where the compatibility is based on shared intellect and personality and outlook in life. For me the life of the mind always counted more then the life of the body. There are other people out there, who do not focus on the physical body to the detriment of everything else.

Dr. Phil Show: World's Biggest Bride: Confessions of an 800-Pound Woman

I have posted about Susanne Eman before...

see:

"Dying to the Fattest Woman on Dr. Oz"

I have to admit, I tried to watch this show, but got too disgusted dealing with some of my own issues and health problems, didn't feel like listening to Dr. Phil castigate fat people for "committing slow suicide" which he kept repeating over and over. The thing that is so sad about this, is this lady who has participated in this circus side show, will help perpetuate stereotypes about the overweight that we all overeat, and that we have chosen our fate, through her would be feederism participation. Here we see the false notion that most people choose to be ultra-obese advanced.Also I saw the part where she showed utter delusion about her obesity as if she was "healthy", I thought to myself here is more of the Obesity Hegelian Dialectic! I think even having the sister claim she eats healthy, was to help to add to the confusion and to help silence us fat people who are trying to get help beyond the EAT LESS mantras.

I tried to write on the Dr. Phil message boards, a response and sticking up for people in my position but they censored it and would not post it. Guess I am not surprised.

"Guys Who Like Fat Chicks"

"Guys Who Like Fat Chicks"

Warning the above article has some risque language.

I have written about the fat admirers before..."Chubby Chasers Give Me the Willies!" This article seems to back up what I said. Seeing women like in one giant meat-market as a bunch of body parts...

Entries happily, ravenously, robustly referenced double bellies, back rolls, and “big old ham thighs.” Feminine body shapes were compared to pears, apples, and one calabash squash; their weights spanned from 180 pounds to over 500.

and

In person at the East Village's Cafe Orlin, Dan explains that, yes, he likes round bellies. He likes double chins. He likes breasts the size of his head. He loves flabby biceps. “Fat upper arms are awesome. I would almost say I’m an arms guy,” he says, not by any means whispering. “I didn’t know that they would be that soft. I, like, fell asleep on a girl’s arm once. I was like, ‘Wow.’ ”

Excuse me, if I feel a bit creeped out. Maybe I am old fashioned, no let me say this, I AM old fashioned, some of you probably would think I belong back in 1880, and that's just fine with me! I read that and think- "look's like the "body is everything" stuff got to the fat people", and these skinny guys who are interested in dating them. Hey there is a person in there!

OK, I get that people are attracted to certain things, and to be with someone you want does take some chemistry, but it shouldn't mean everything. Relationships have to go beyond just a body that attracts you in the room, there has to be some personality and mental interest...remember the soul? Oh yeah, it's like they forgot about that!

This weird labeling of fat admiration, like other sexual categories is just odd.

Fat Admirers (FA) have historically adopted queer nomenclature for their self-discovery stages and preferences. Men who openly pursue, prefer, and date fat women are “out.” Men who like fat women but more or less hide them from friends and family are “closeted.” Men who say they like both skinny and supersize women ones are “bisizuals,” a controversial term that’s regarded as disingenuous in various online circles.

I never heard of "bisizuals" guess you learn something new everyday. The ones who hide their heavier girlfriends, are brainwashed by society and lack courage, and that lady should run not walk from such a relationship.

The article goes on to list "misconceptions" about the chubby chasers, LOL I think the writer would see ME as holding a few...but then I wrote from what I saw...perhaps not all the men take it as far as others but I'll stand by what I wrote in the other article.

This sentence is telling...

"Nope. Lawrence, who sometimes fantasizes about a 550-pound wife, thinks the smallest he could go would be 180 pounds, though that veers into bisizualism."

Who wants to just be a fantasy? Not me. I wonder if he realizes that a 550lb wife means he would be having to do a lot of errands, and helping take care of her? Maybe that's why he knows he has to go smaller, in facing reality.

The rest of the article goes on. I am glad that fat women, can get boyfriends. Why should men only date the skinny minnies? But part of me cringes that that just the act of dating someone who is heavy, earns you a special name and subculture and almost a metal! It seems to me fat women got husbands even 50 plus years ago, and they didn't have to go to a NAAFA meeting to find one either.

Fat people deserve love too, but there is a lot of weird baggage and debauchery that goes with the fat admirer world. One thing I want to ask is how come it's always skinny dudes going with the fat women? That is one weird thing, I guess if some guy is over 230lbs, he is fat too and not a fat admirer.

When I was younger and even at my severe high weights, I did get hit on, would just say "I am married, thanks but no thanks", and walk on. So I know these guys are out there, whatever their intentions were towards me. I was spoken for pretty young--by 25, and married by 29, and spent the majority of my 20s midsized before my weight gain, so the whole fat admirer thing didn't really register on my radar til after I was attached. I'm glad I didn't have to go swim in that slimy pond for a mate.

Chubby Chasers Give Me the Willies!

Chubby Chasers and Fat Admirers/Fetishes:, the men that are out there with their overwhelming desire for the full figure and who love fat women over all other kinds. I have absolutely nothing against a man who thinks a 300-lb. and over woman is beautiful, as a summation of all her parts personality, values, and even, yes, looks, but to be frank the ones who have turned fat into a top priority and a fetish creep me out.

I'm glad whoever wrote this Wikipedia entry on fat fetishism gave a nod to fat people in size acceptance who got a bit fed up with the objectification of fat women. This website will help explain some terms I use here, like "fat admirers" [though they hold a more fence-sitting view], feederism and more.

Some people involved in the fat acceptance movement argue that fat fetishism undermines social movements towards fat acceptance, through counter-productive objectification and dehumanization of fat people.

This may be politically incorrect to some liberals and others but when it comes to Chubby Chasers and "Fat Admirers", outside of men who are dating fat women because they are overweight themselves, or looking for you as a whole person....Run like the wind!

I was a pretty enough woman [today I'm much older with years of illness notched on my belt], which garnered their attention, and have had some chubby chasing type strangers, show up at the grocery store, bookstore, and other places, come up to me to say "hello". Perhaps some were truly interested in me as a person, but I know especially at my peak weights, I was fat enough to gain some attention, and in my case, was oh so young, when hitting the top weights. Anyhow, their efforts were for naught, hitting on a woman who was attached by age 25.

Years ago, once at a conference for fat people, I got a secret admirer sniffing my trail and remember telling a lady whom he wanted to serve as a go-between: "Tell him, I'm married!" In certain circles of size acceptance, this was no stumbling block, but of course it was for me.

Luckily this man didn't even know my name or address, but a realization hit me: somebody who never spoke to me was enamored because of how I looked. Now this can happen to all women, thin women talk about their objectification, and when a men and women do meet each other, appearances is all they got to go on in the first seconds and minutes of meeting each other, but it just felt weird overall.

This is because by then, I had seen so much weird stuff around me. As a fully monogamous, then engaged and married woman, I was an outside viewer to the size acceptance date and relate world. I know today I was beyond very horribly naive, in thinking these groups could be about platonic friendship, size activism and not just about sex, but then being in the 500-lb. and rising class, social isolation from my size was already affecting me and I just wanted to make regular friends. My experiences include some fat acceptance conferences and social groups that focused on BBWs and larger women.

When it came to the men, the few good ones loved fat women regardless of their weight -- maybe they were overweight themselves, maybe they had grown up among a loved fat role model -- anyhow, they just saw weight as a physical trait, and did not glorify it. These were the ones who were overweight themselves or in some way, could relate to previously suffering from obesity or growing up with it in some way.

The worst men gravitated towards fat women whose mannerisms left their would be suitors believing that they were passive, compliant and easily controlled. In some cases, this was true, in others the vultures left empty-handed, sorely disappointed.

I believe most fat women who are mid-sized can date normally, the world is full of all sorts of sizes in healthy marriages, but very super-sized women especially need to be careful. People under turmoil and in vulnerable positions can attract those who do not have their best interests at heart. One friend said it this way, "Broken people can attract other broken people". This doesn't mean everyone who is very fat is "broken," but definitely they are facing things the normal healthy folks are not facing. This may include severe health problems or food addiction.

I have heard horrifying stories, even from other people in size acceptance circles and organizations, about the treatment of very large women. They ranged from an 800-lb.-plus woman being kept entrapped in a walk-in closet on the floor, to finding out about feeders. I had the experience of befriending a lady near my size [she was in the high 400s], thinking we would relate to each other, and then being shocked on finding her feederism website. That new friendship was ended quickly.

There are men who like their women more easily controlled and that can happen especially with fat women facing mobility problems. Very fat people who have faced social ostracization or rejection need to be extra careful as to their selection out in the dating world.

But as an outside observer, with my fiance and then husband at my side, it was quite obvious -- for men, it was an absolute buyer's market with women always outnumbering the men. While some men were overweight, super-sized men were basically nonexistent, and most of the chubby chasers were of a thin or average build. Married or otherwise attached couples made up a sizable number, but still remained in the minority. This was no place for Christians or the traditional, which is one reason I left size acceptance too. A wedding ring meant little, judging by the men who ignored the silver circle on my left hand and those of other women.

It seemed when fat women discovered the opportunities in this new "fat-loving" underground, they went absolutely boy crazy like teenagers. But boy crazy at 35 or 44 is different then boy crazy at 15; hotel rooms can be rented, and trips made with no more required parental supervision. It was no holds barred.

Promiscuity ruled that world [and I think it would be worse today], which is why I removed myself from it. This applied not only to the socially focused groups, but the activism one as well. Ideas about platonic friendship and finding a wouldbe fat sisterhood was a joke, in that crowd. My morals didn't fit into this hedonistic mentality, where very fat women offered themselves to any man who'd have them driven by the nudge that whispered, "Take what you can get honey!"

I still remember one conversation I had with one of the ladies in one of these social groups. "Hilda" [name has been changed] reveled in her largeness, claiming that she liked weighing 320 lbs., and when she fell under that oddly chosen benchmark, ate to get back up there, and dieted to not get too much over it, fearing the immobility that comes with larger sizes. She'd married a very timid man, who catered to all her desires who openly admitted he was only with her because she was fat.

One day I made the mistake of asking, "Well what would happen if you lost weight, say, to getting a digestive disorder or something?" "Hilda" didn't hem or haw for a instant: "Well, that probably would be the end of it!", she said.

It didn't take too to figure out that others like "Hilda" populated these scenes; outside of the regular world of dating and marriage, very fat women seemed all too vulnerable to the new flattery they encountered, and became easy marks for the most predatory of men. This doesn't mean there aren't thin women who also become marks, but just seeing human beings treat each other as objects will forever stay with me.

Towards the end, before I cleared out for good, I realize that some fat acceptance organizations seemed far more interested in fulfilling and pleasing chubby chaser and fat fetish/admirer desires, then raising any awareness or help for fat people. I want to keep this article rated G, but I found out about too much: women my size signing up to have soft porn videos made of them [they were told it would "empower" them], realizing swinging wasn't just something left behind in the 70s. You know life has gotten strange when your local plus sized social club, calls you "the prude" because of your refusal to join in on their lifestyle choices. By then I had seen enough.

A Revealing Conversation On Size Acceptance and Health

I and a fellow endocrine sufferer, who I appreciate very much, shares her common experiences with hormonal health challenges and size acceptance. We agree on much. [My questions in blue] Read on:

1. Describe your experience with size acceptance, what did you find positive about it, what did you find negative?

I originally joined the size acceptance movement in 1996. After purchasing my first personal computer and joining the citizens of the internet from home, I stumbled across the Dimensions Magazine website that broadcast the statement: Where Big is Beautiful. The print magazine articles were written by men and women who took pride in themselves as a whole person. This was a new discovery for me, having been a fat teenager and dealing with discrimination, bullies, and general bias because of my size.

I spent a few years mostly reading and studying materials from the NAAFA and Dimensions Magazine, and researching the phenomenon that is fat acceptance.

Over time, I began to learn that for me, the journey to "Size Acceptance" is really a journey of "Self Acceptance" rather than coming to terms with being just fat. As a person, I learned from the SA movement that I have a right to enjoy life just as I am. Since that time, I've even been able to help friends of all sizes come to terms with their own bodies. It's been an interesting journey. When I tell women with low self esteem that I love my body and who I am-- they begin to wonder how "I" could love myself, when they see me as socially unacceptable!

Things I learned from SA:
Doctors usually believe you're fat because you're lazy. Little research and questioning is done for fat people. Diet and exercise are the common prescriptions. Many fat people then turn to alternative medicine or "acceptance" of themselves and then fail to get help! Fat and sexuality are not mutually exclusive. Many people can and so see through the fog of the myth that fat people are somehow second-rate.

My opinions matter, no matter how fat I am! The anonymity of the SA movement online has helped many fat people find their confidence and ability to speak in regards to various issues. I think this has helped the most in fat people learning to advocate for themselves. They know they're not alone, and can voice their opinions.

Society still has yet to accept fat people as the norm in America. Theater seats are uncomfortable, airplane seats and being asked to purchase two seats is the norm. Bathroom stalls are too small. Stairs are too steep. Booths at restaurants are made with fixed tables. Hospital gowns for fat patients are hard to find (and you're made to feel like a freak if you ask for a larger gown at times). Chairs at airports and doctor's office have arms that can cause physical harm to a fat person.

There's a bias in America that fat people are nonsexual. That's so far from the truth! We are human beings just like everyone else, and we have carnal desires, wants and needs to be loved, feel affection and physical attraction. The lies that are perpetuated by the media don't help any.

Size Acceptance has its own militant activists just like every other agenda.

I am still a member of the SA movement, but left my formal advocacy agenda in late 2008.


2. How did you come to be diagnosed with Cushings?

When visiting a new doctor one day in 2007, I was bemoaning to my doctor that for years I'd been battling a host of issues that I thought were just normal things for a fat person. After years of being told that I was fat, lazy, an over-eater and I would have to deal with my health issues -- this new doctor started to ask questions. Every answer I gave created a new question. At the end of an hour-long exam, the doctor asked me if I'd heard of Cushing's Disease. I hadn't yet, but then she explained the textbook symptoms.

The trouble from that point was that local doctors aren't trained in what to do with Cushing's patients, and you have to find an Endocrinologist that understands the disease. There are few specialists who truly understand the full body of research in regards to this endocrine disorder. I saw two local Endocrinologists who laughed me out of their offices despite my doctor's referral. Finally, after much research on the internet and talking to my doctor, I found Dr. Ted Friedman in Los Angeles. Dr. Friedman took the time to meet with me, look at my history of pictures from spanning from current days to my childhood, looked at all of my physical signs and symptoms and prescribed a very focused and intricate testing regimen. After only 46 days of tests, MRIs and discussion, it was decided that I had been living with this disease some call the "Ugly disease" since birth.

Since that time, I have had two pituitary surgeries to help establish a period of remission of all of the difficult symptoms. After each surgery I've enjoyed 6 months of improvement.

3. Do you feel support was lacking in the size acceptance community regarding your diagnosis with Cushings?

Once I shared my disorder, the problems it caused for me, and that I was pursuing a cure for my issues, things began to change for me. When I announced I was having pituitary surgery to work towards a cure, I was treated like someone who didn't know what was right for myself. Constantly people were telling me reconsider such a "drastic surgery" that they felt could leave me crippled for life. Despite all my assurances that I looked at every angle, I received countless phone calls, emails and visits from people who insisted I was making a wrong choice. When I needed support the most from my friends, a dichotomy arose -- that of having to deal with friends who felt I was fat for life, and that of trying to cure a deadly disease.


4. Do you agree that in size acceptance there is a lack of truth about obesity being for some people a symptom of a disease process?

Many of my fat friends categorize their fat as a physical trait, and refuse to believe that obesity is a serious medical condition.

While I personally believe a rubenesque woman can be fit and fluffy, there are many fat people who have serious medical conditions that may go undiagnosed because of their attitude towards size acceptance, their fear of the doctors being emotionally cruel to them, and that there aren't any real serious medical diseases for fat people.

In many circles in the SA community, the talk of "dieting" is forbidden. The reason being that fat people need a place of solace from the people telling them that diets will solve all their problems and they refuse to diet. I can see the point in this argument, but the people that can't diet to lose weight have serious medical issues that should be addressed! I'm sure some people who say they diet really don't and they are fooling themselves, but people like me who eat only 1100 calories a day and gain weight have metabolic disorders that need serious help!

Diseases I've seen friends suffer with from obesity related issues:

Lypo/Lymphadema
High Blood Pressure
Heart Attacks
Deep Vein Thrombosis
Diabetes
Osteoarthritis
Osteopenia
PCOS
Cushing's Disease
Hypothyroidism
Growth Hormone Deficiency

The website bigfatfacts states: Weight is not a barometer of wellness. More Americans die every year from weighing too little than from weighing too much. An estimated 25,000 people die from obesity. Moderately overweight people live longer than those at normal weight. (Flegal, et. al.) (See reference notes at bottom of report)

Weight is not a barometer of wellness! So a fat person can have normal blood pressure, activity level, blood sugar, and labwork. But notice here it says moderately overweight people live longer. Most of my friends in size acceptance are overweight into the hundreds of pounds. Dear friends of mine are over 400 pounds, and one is over 500. Somewhere fat does become a barometer for wellness!



5. Where do you think the size acceptance movement is headed today? Do you think it has a future?

Size Acceptance is splintering into various new groups and is no longer a united front. Some advocacy groups want fat to be declared a disability, yet some don't. If it's a disability, then is it not healthy then? Other groups are insisting that super-sized people shouldn't be part of mainstream size acceptance as they are the "freaks" of the movement.

These kinds of separate attitudes don't do any fat person any good, and it's a shame to see that happening. I wish to think that in the future, we'll find a better united front and be able to be inclusive again.