Thursday, December 17, 2015

The Grand Clean-Out

When you start drawing boundaries against narcissistic and abusive family members, they start being applied to the rest of your life. You will find yourself ending other relationships.  This means some will end. In changing the patterns a narcissistic family set upon your life, you will be changing your pattern with other people and places.

It's like someone wrote me on a support board, using the empty room metaphor, because you have gotten rid of the "junk" you can now "furnish" the room with excellent quality furniture, people who are true friends and who won't treat you like how your family did. When I went NC two and half years ago, it has given me time to see the life-long patterns I have fallen into with other people.

While some relationships are intact, and working out, many were not. I realized I had people in my life who treated me the same way my family did, who took me for granted, broke my boundaries, and disrespected me. We don't need to diagnose everyone with narcissism that may not be good for us, even if some you walk away from other would be narcissists, enablers and flying monkeys. One thing you will do is wake up and realize YOU WANT SOMETHING DIFFERENT.

 Deciding it is better to be "alone" then put up with narcissist abuse is scary.  This is at least 30 people now I have walked away from.  One now ex-friend who lived long distance actually told me when I went no contact from the family, "There won't be anyone left and you will be all alone". There was no support there. In a way I knew things were doomed at that point, I was walking down a very different road and had to do what was best for me. And yes this world will scare many ACONS, telling them...YOU WILL BE ALONE, so they hang in with abusers for years because of this fear.  Many in society will back up that message. This message of fear keeps many subservient on their knees before narcissists.

In fact this is one reason I stuck by my family so long, I didn't want to go without a family. I didn't want to be alone, but I was already alone! Its a reason I put up with many toxic relationships in my life going back to my 20s. My loneliness and desperation put me in the position to take all "comers" and anyone who would have me. It made me sad thinking about what I put up with because I was so desperate for love and acceptance.

Being an Aspie compounded this. ACONs can be prone to this. Our family has rejected us and inside we yearn, and yes I know I still have it, for a new "family" who will accept and love us. I have had some "found families" over the years but many of those end when people move away or other things happen. I have to learn healthier ways to deal with this.

One thing I had to teach myself, was to say "It is okay to be alone", "you are not a bad person if you do not have masses of people around you". When I was young I had a hard time being alone and couldn't bear it while the me of today has been able to accept it. The worse thing in life isn't always actually being alone, sometimes it can be wishing you were alone because of those you are around. Being in the position where you can't be yourself around people is more lonely then sitting in a room alone. While seeking connections is part of the human condition and it's grown more difficult, the stronger we grow in ourselves, the more we can be "alone" and bear it, and find new and healthier relationships.

Here is one thing too, once you get away from the toxics, your truly loving and good relationships will grow stronger. I and my husband after I went no contact from most of the family especially grew closer and stronger in our marriage. We always had been close but it was like a monkey was thrown off both our backs. I saw him for the kind, loyal and truly giving man he is who stuck by me in thick and thin instead of the constant negative messages from my family who put him down along with me. He stuck by his ideals too and never wavered. I stop blaming him for things, they told me I should blame him for. My other friendships have increased in closeness. I can tell people I love them now and share more vulnerable feelings because those "good" or what some would see as the "softer" parts of my personality are in a more safe place.

This can happen to ACON scapegoats too where they have the numbers game played on them:

Some would say "How could you not see yourself as the problem if you are being treated so badly by so many?" Well that can be a line that will fool ACONS especially scapegoats. There is another trap that can happen lifelong. Your narcissistic mother sneers, "No one likes you" for decades and decades and such a thing infuses into your mind. Your life is then spent trying to get people to like you which brings abusers and toxic social death. Of course you end up in a pit with some abusers in it that you must dig yourself out of.

I was lucky, because in the mix I had a loving and loyal husband and some real friends but for many scapegoats, our families set us up to be involved with other narcissists, toxic people, abusers and those seeking after narcissistic supply.

So you go No contact and then start thinking, "Who do I like?", "What do I value?" and start wondering why you are begging for crumbs.

It's like I woke up out of a second fog, and thought...

1. I don't have to take this crap anymore either. I don't have to put up with anyone who treats me with the same superiority and dismissive attitude of the narcissists I walked away from. I don't have to put up with people who use guilt and always put me last or as a low priority or who want to drain me dry.

2. I don't feel like begging for crumbs or begging to be liked, I just don't want to work that hard at it anymore. That one was quite a revelation. I'm done beating my head against that damn wall.

3. Why be deal with people who spit on the things you value, or who are workaholics or who have sold their souls to the system?  As a Christian, I had to question some of my involvements. People who love the system and are part of the evil machinations of this world without any thoughts of right and wrong, society's weak and vulnerable, or true justice, well, they have no reason to be in my life.

4. Why hang around people that make you feel on edge and like you are not enough?

I want to ask other ACONs here, after going no contact did you see your social circles massively change? Did you do a grand clean-out too? It's altering relationships in general. When a person starts drawing boundaries, asserting themselves and refusing all forms of abuse, it changes them. This can be a scary step as you ask yourself what's next.  However I am realizing too I am happier even in a more simplified life, being okay and more content at a slower pace.


  1. I know I can literally look at my life in two parts. That part before my mother died and the part after. You would think it would be the part before I went No Contact and the part after going no contact. Going NC just sent her under ground to sabotage me from afar. If a person, place, or thing was involved with her before she died, I don't trust that she didn't in some way corrupt it.

    1. I understand. I still have people being turned against me today and am not naïve about what is being done behind the scenes. A niece I had contact with refused to befriend me on Facebook, but I have to shrug and not take it personal anymore and not bang my head on the brick walls anymore. She's trained them all to reject and treat me like garbage. I had to "give up" with the process above. Frankly I can't trust anyone who has any contact with her. She corrupts everything and everyone she touches on my end too and I'm sure yours did too. I definitely understand you when you divide it into two parts.

  2. Dear Peeps and Friends, it just seems that people are becoming meaner. Been doing a bit of decluttering myself. As soon as someone opens their mocking yap, that's my cue to get out the broom and the dustpan.

    1. I think people are getting meaner too. Of course it's not everyone but you have to be careful out there. Yep, the mocking garbage time for the broom and dustpan. I know I don't have time or patience for that crap anymore.

    2. Dear Peeps, i have to get away and stay away from people with a mocking attitude, because sticking around would just lead me into sin (i do enough of that as it is). One started in about two weeks ago, and by the Lord's restraining grace, i quietly picked up my purse, and politely ended the visit. The whole hour i was there, couldn't help but to notice a haughty spirit. Can't say i am looking forward to another visit either. Yeah, i've forgiven the person, but still even when someone forgives, there's still consequences. Too bad preachers don't explain that forgiveness cannot always wash away the consequences that effect both / all parties involved.

    3. Yeah I used to argue with them but I had to learn when I did argue with them, I was giving them what they wanted, feeding off the negative emotions. I will still stand up if I have to, but yeah it's better to just get away. The bible warns about those with a HAUGHTY spirit, and I really didn't know what that meant until recently. They are so prideful and consider themselves always right. I am glad you were able to forgive. So few repent and say they are sorry though. LOL I agree forgiveness doesn't wash away consequences for someone who has refused to repent. I just stay away from mocking and haughty people.

  3. I was always seen as being the problem too. I couldn't go anywhere without someone mistreating me, so therefore I must be the problem. I never sought out problems. You'd think I did. It was just crazy.

    But now, my whole life has changed. The MN's in my circle, don't even bother with me, and I see them looking for targets and smirking, but I am not included in their campaigns anymore. Its like a new lease on life. And, oops, sorry, one just recently teased me for not wanting to eat cookies, but I was trying to watch what I eat, I'm just a sugar junkie, well, she teased me and mocked me. I just looked at her straight in the eye, she bowed down and totally changed the subject. I continued with my long stare and she got up and left the room. It was so funny.

    Why couldn't I have had this decades ago. I love it. Grand clean out for sure.

    1. Yes I relate. Well into later adulthood I got left alone more, but remember I'm big. Most people don't want to mess with someone my size LOL but to be honest, I hate asking people I don't know for things because that is an opening for a mean person to step on through. If you are in need you are vulnerable. My husband is telling me step out of any stores where they get an attitude with you, there's somewhere better to go. Fortunately most clerks around here are nicer but it is something to watch out for.

      I'm kind of in withdrawal mode right now, well housebound presently but I hope things change for me too, socially and otherwise. I think the MNs are ignoring me more, I sure hope so. Maybe I can see them quicker. Once our radar is sharpened, they probably see us less as prey. I'm glad you looked that teasing narc in the eye and she walked away.

      I think our lives change when we are on to them and done with putting up with crap. I look back and think too, oh if only I know what I know now at the age of 20, or earlier but we know it now and can be done with them and not sitting there having them extract narcissistic supply from us. Yes the grand clean out for sure, and honestly, I feel RELIEF.

    2. I think sometimes our vulnerabilities can expose the MN's faster, so that can be good. Like I'm a sugar junkie, immediately when I heard her mocking me, I knew and I can now be done with her. And it was my vulnerability that exposed her. Otherwise, she was just a regular middle aged housewife, yeah right! Who likes to tease me on my addiction. I don't know how a normal person would find humor in that. Not just laugh, she mocked and sarcastically repeated what I had said.

      I'm sorry to hear you are housebound, I know that must be hard. I'll be praying for you. I know that they don't see me as prey as much. And I can't believe how easy this is, I have been in torment all my life and have bad nerves because of it.

      I think a lot of it has to do with me not looking up to them anymore, or believing that I'm the cause of it. I just look at them and see the truth and its ridiculous.

    3. If you want to eat some sugar, it's your right. Look they hide all their failings and then act like judge and jury on us. Some bitching you out for eating too many deserts for all you know are going home to suck on the crack pipe or to swallow endless pills. I have realized that those who mock or comment on endless 'weaknesses' they wish to exploit are to be avoided like the plague. One red flag I know to look for in the future is when they go on and on about the weaknesses of everyone else and how everyone else is a "loser", "a bum", "can't keep a job", "a hoarder", "an embarrassment to their family" and so forth and so on.

      Thanks regarding me being housebound. I feel restless right now which makes it kind of worse LOL, I think I get to escape on Monday when our "global warming extreme" winter brings the weather back to 50 but right now its, in the low 30s and below.

      I am glad people don't see you as prey anymore. I hope to get there, I have the visible disabilities with can be a barrier but I'm not taking any more crap. I know I don't want any noses in the air and "correctors" lambasting my every move. What are those kind of people going to give me but grief? Most arrived on easy street too via no extra effort of their own either.

      Yeah you see them for what they are. I am there too.

  4. I recall my mother telling me that no one could stand me, which really really hurt me. This is such a devastating statement to say to a child.

    1. Mine said it my whole life until I got away. It went along with "no one likes you". I wish I had the guts to say, "I don't like you, you suck" but I guess I will write it here instead. Once I wrote her that having people afraid of you didn't mean they loved you. I hope you are NC with this mother, she deserves no less.

    2. Dear Anonymous, i cannot help but to wonder how many lonesome nursing home residents had spouted the same sort of crap to their children. And now will, maybe, get a holiday card, but not a visit - at least a visit lasting more than 10 minutes. And mutha sits and whines to the staff and the other residents about her "ungrateful" child. Peepull are so quick to judge, peepull didn't grow up under that harpy's rule. i'm not claiming that every lonely nursing-home resident was a mean-spirited parent, but certainly there are some who were.

    3. Years ago I watched a tv talk show involving a mother and her now adult children. She kept trying to play the victim. She collapsed on the floor. Her children did not react. They were used to the lies and the bs. Members of the audience were like how could you do that to your mother?! They have no clue. I frequently wonder what my life would have been like without all the years of abuse. People who were not abused as children simply do not understand the extensive damage it causes.

    4. I would think some lonely old people are in the nursing home and reaping the benefits of their wicked works. Probably once the nursing home got in the game, the flying monkeys and enablers all kissing butt for the inheritance check out at that point because they know the nursing home gets the big money and not them. Yes people are quick to judge. I imagine theres many who have gone NC for years and years and horribly judged for abandoning their parent in need.

      I was ignored and pushed away and ostracized for my own ill health, and had no choice but go to NC even for my own physical well-being. I hate to say it but the GC sister has no empathy and maybe one day when she is very old and sick which probably is sooner then later, since she is almost 70 years old, she will realize what she put in motion. She will know then she bet on the wrong horse to take care of her in her old age. I wonder how many of these narcs pay the piper for that. The GCs aren't exactly going to be kind and caring caretakers.

    5. One collapsing on the floor sounds like she is on the histrionic wing. Sure some fool people with those games. The adult children then got condemned for not giving into the lies and BS. I wonder what my life would have been like too. I doubt I would have gotten so sick. I would have gotten help. Well I can only deal with what I have control over.

  5. I think that fear of being alone is actually a continuation into adult life of the fear of Abandonment they inculcated in us from the time we were very small children-and possibly still pre-verbal. By the time we're 3, we're able to conceptualize that without the care and protection of our primary caretaker(s) we would not survive. Our continuing dependence on them growing up becomes a Tool they will manipulate as they choose the time and place to use it: "No one likes you," "You'll end up alone" or some variation of this Theme leaves us fearful of our own abilities to be very comfortable in our own skins and a threat to our very survival. Developing confidence in oneself as a competent, capable human being is systematically undermined by these kinds of messages.
    Once again, they lied.
    Once again, until you step back, you will not clearly see how extensive this kind of behavior/message permeates your Identity and undermines your autonomy. We have so many underlying unexamined fellacious Beliefs that really cripple us unnecessarily (and strategically) so that we feel we MUST keep the EPs/"faaaamily" etc. in our lives. Ever notice how the "Family" card is played as soon as they see you refusing even in a small/insignificant way to continue playing your assigned family role? Yet when YOU used "Family" to appeal to them, suddenly "Family" disappears and is re-configured into you being somehow lacking/"needy"/a PITA/"Demanding"-fill in the blank with just a simple example of your own about what happened when you attempted to play YOUR "family" (their Get Out of Jail Free) you'll find they did exactly nothing to aid/assist, sabotaged your efforts, used it to undermine you etc. conveniently turning this whole "Faaaamily" concept into yet another "example" of your unworthiness/incompetence. See how that works?!

    I agree-I also started clearing house in other areas of my life as well post NC-but not immediately. I was too busy putting the pieces of me and my life together in a new and much more realistic, examined manner. Since my "Normal Meter" had been so broken, it took a period of grieving the primary losses before I turned my attention to how those dynamics I grew up with were permeating the present in the form of other relationships in my adult life. It became far more than merely a "pruning;" it was a wholesale, "Nope, Nope, Nope." While I was early in NC and grieving, I pulled back in any event from others-I didn't have the energy left over to deal with a lot of superficial and or energy sucking types in my life. I actually NEED my "alone" time now and have for decades: Just time to think, re-charge, do the things I like to do, associate with a very few individuals who understand I may kind of fall off the radar for awhile and they get it. It's not about them, it's me intentionally listening to myself telling me to back off for awhile. It's about impossible to "hear" yourself when you've been assiduously trained to IGNORE your own voice/needs-they're "selfish," "You'll end up alone!" and all the other "voices" that are NOT your's.
    The more I became comfortable in my own skin, the more meaningful the remaining people and my relationship with them became, the more deeply I appreciated their Authencity, the quiet joy of having these people in my life, the more important Reciprocal relationships became to me. As soon as it becomes obvious I am not "allowed" to say "No" and have it respected, the more likely I am to quietly fade from their radar. Self-protection in action.
    Which is my long-winded way of saying, "Yep, Peep!"

    1. Yes I was talking about this yesterday with a close friend TW, the whole fear of "being alone". I was worse in my 20s but the idea of having "no friends" and "no body" was even worse then. I have grown more comfortable being alone now but there is something in me always pushing myself "socially" to prove myself and innoculate against this "lonely" feeling. This is more complicated even with Aspergers. I put up with a lot of garbage for too long fearing be alone. I agree when we were pre-verbal we knew already we were abandoned and "not loved". This is the void many scapegoated ACONs can exist with. We know we are not loved or accepted like other children. Indifferent and pissed off caretakers and even open neglect and being ignored for some of us. There's a reason my mother bragged of being able to leave me alone for hours in my crib. One thought there, "Why did she want to?"
      So yes they use that dependency tool and tell you that no one else will have you, the world hates you too and feels the same way "I" do about you. We become afraid to just be ourselves. The other day I thought about how I was put in the position of always "proving" myself and never loved unconditionally. Banging my head against that proverbial wall. We fail to grow comfortable in our own skin. I felt REJECTED to the core and used to think at a very young age, "how can I be me, when "me" is so hated? They really did intense damage and then add on the baggage of a rare illness and an extreme 1 in 5 million body.

      Their sabotage and smear campaigns undermind our attempts to grow into adulthood and become compentent and functional adults. Yes they lied to us telling we were unacceptable and not good enough for anyone. But even there, they lied to us about being human beings, and having worth and value in ourselves not dependent on the approval or love of anyone else.


    2. This one I think is one to keep us in the family life long. They set us up for financial and other disasters, there's a reason she got my father to give her every dime as I was dying of poverty and severely disabled. It is only over last few years I realized to what depth of evil that was and what a POS it made her. Not because I was greedy, but that was a time in life I need some help to even just survive. Normal families do not allow a severely disabled member of the family to go die, without any help or involvement in their life. I even met a new disabled would be friend. His brother takes care of him and he is in far better shape then I am. The real world showed to me that people who faced challenges even far less then mine, had families help them and did not shame or blame or seek to destroy them for those challenges. They did not cut off people for having illness or other problems. So I was ignored, my needs devalued but they kept me in the game just enough to say I was around while not having me around. The scapegoating process, will have that odd mixture of being invisible and alone but God help you if you cut them off and walk totally, as I wrote, "They left me far before I left them" on that other article. So yes the FAMILY word is played. By the way I hate that word FAMILY. I know I shouldn't but I even think of Henry Rollins spitting out the word FAMILY in his rant Family Man, and wonder if he was an ACON. I remember one day Aunt Denial when she was visiting my mother's house, going on about what a close and loving family we had. I snorted and said "Yeah right" and she turned and looked at me with her googly eyes, and was in shock but that's one who was never there for me in any real way either. What a joke! So yeah they congratulate themselves on their breeding and money making abilities but the whole FAMILY thing is a utter lie. You"ll die without your family they'll say, and our culture backs this up, with no kinfolk you will die, blah blah, but with "families" like these what use are they? I never had one. I had a few crumbs of help to keep me in the game, but when push came to shove and I was dying in hospitals or even severely ill in 2013, they were too busy and could not be bothered. I faced facts going NC, I really was ALREADY ALONE as far as a family was concerned.

    3. I am glad you outlined the process you went through TW, because I am in it, clearing house in other areas of my life post NC. Trying to analyze where I am at. Realizing that some things I have poured energy into are a waste of time. Outside of the close inner circle of husband and friends, I have massively socially withdrawn, I suppose this is a natural part of the healing process.

      Im look at my own NORMAL meter and realizing how off it was even in the "friendship" department. I got real and good friends but many narcs in the mix, who by the way even before I woke up totally I kept thinking "Why are they treating me like my family" Where they would pooh-pooh my illnesses, or put off visits--endless rejection always choosing the job or other people and I thought of one long distance one, so why am I devoting all this time to her, when she can't even stay loyal among strangers? Ah it's tilted everything, more to a normal place. I am waking up to those dynamics too massively.

      I agree this has gone beyond pruning for me, it is screaming NO WAY, NO MORE> I'm tired and I AM WASTING MY TIME>

      I agree with needing time to rest, recharge, and just doing things I find fun. Time caccooning. People who will understand this.

      I'm in the middle of asking myself what do I want? Getting to know myself. Away from the voices that told me "family" counted for everything, ones that remained tethered to their families with a giant chain around their necks, it wasn't doing it for me.

      Yes we are taking the time to find authenticity and realness and people we can be comfortable around and don't have to prove ourselves to. Who will truly love and accept us and be there for us and who will respect who we are and our values.

      Thanks for your comments TW. :)

  6. Yes, a thousand times, YES. Mine did not care when I was starving to death, freezing to death, essentially homeless, chronically ill etc. We are often subject to economic abuse/neglect-but you can be sure if we did have resources, they'd be right there with their greedy hands out demanding their "share" and playing the "Faammily" Card, right down to robbing their kid's piggy banks. That certainly was my experience. And our resources may not even begin to match their's before they start demanding their "Cut"<in their typical Extortionist style. And they absolutely ARE Extortionists-of every last morsel of love, respect, positive regard, joy, peace, affection-all the "good stuff" material and otherwise life can offer us, but not while we remain subject to our CB "parents." Or those of their ilk.
    You have a great deal of insight into the dynamics of your experiences then and how they play out in the here and now. This is a huge benefit of NC, the ability to "see" with increasing clarity exactly the process and products of growing up CB "parented." This truly is a time of Transition and Transformation for you. It seems more and more you are really on a journey of self-discovery. It's been such an honor to witness how this as it unfolds and is impacting all areas of your life internally and externally. You have worked SO HARD to get here, Peep. I don't think you realize at all your inherent decency and goodness in addition to smarts and artistic as well as other gifts. Since when does Autism exclude having such wonderful human qualities?!

    You also reminded me of another event in my own life when you shared how your CB "mother" commented on her "ability" to leave you in your crib for hours at a time-do you really think a remotely normal parent would view this as a GOOD thing? Ahh, NO! This could very well be indicative of Learned Helplessness on the part of the infant-that response is CLASSIC Learned Helplessness in action. My memory in response to your sharing this was about spending the summer with my Aunt, Uncle and 8 cousins in Chicago when I was a traumatized 13 yr. old. I have no idea why I was sent and my Nsis wasn't. Anyway, after I came back from that summer (oh, how I hated to leave!) my Aunt mentioned in a phone call to my CB "mother" that I was "far more sophisticated" than her kids. She had a son and daughters right at and around my age. I remember the smirk on my CB "mother's" face after she got off the phone with my Aunt and told me what my Aunt had said. Frankly, if my SIL who had kids around my own kid's age made this observation I'd IMMEDIATELY be asking questions like, "How is she more sophisticated? Please give me behavioral examples." An observation like that would have me as a Mom on point immediately: That's not necessarily a feather in your "Mom" cap by a long shot and would mever have passed unquestioned.

    Anyway, you are a joy to me, as selfish as that sounds-Thank you!

    1. TW you are a joy to me too. Without a doubt :) Your words here have given me so much hope and support. I hope you have a good holiday season and happy new year.

      Yes facing the facts they do not care, can be a hard one. I faced severe deprivation while in my 20s, that makes even today's "poverty" look like the candy days. I had to learn how to use food pantries and find help, and back then I was clueless, and I believe there was less available too. So sorry you went through those things too. That is a grooming process too, so you are desperate and dependent. They set up others they love in good jobs--my father had the instant power to set me up in an instant at least mid 20s in the 1990s easy office job and simply refused. They wanted to see me suffer and I still have the photo of her majorly gloating as she is walking to my Chicago apt door.

      They groom some with the severe poverty, drop a few crumbs so there is gratefulness and desperation and then lord over people and enjoy every minute. Yes if we had money or came into it, they definitely would be right there taking it. Mine helped herself freely to my childhood newspaper money. I had to learn to hide any money so it would not "disappear".

      They extort everything. Mine couldn't leave ONE relative alone for me to have, they had to suck everyone dry and hog it all, including all the attention. Yes when one goes NC, the fog clears and you can see more of what went on. I was numbed out by the abuse and in my sociopathic plotting mother's case, she has the ability to confuse everyone around her and use it to her benefit. I agree this is a time of transition and transformation for me, it has already changed a lot. Thanks for your kind words about me working hard to get here. I sometimes feel weary but glad I have continued on. Thanks for your compliments too, yes being NC, I believe will help a person see themselves more clearly, getting to know myself without their evil blinders put on, will be an immense journey too. Agree about Aspergers. :)
      It was sick that those women nodded and smiled as my mother basically gloated about neglect of an infant. Something was wrong with them too. No normal person would listen to that and think it was OKAY. She obviously had "birds of feather" around her, with one neighbor long time family friend I realized that woman was a narcissist too, and had the golden child rich achiever child and one living in object poverty. I think the husband was more of an E but but not sure.

      Yes an infant that neglected could be in "classic learned helplessness" so agree. Depression can come with learned helplessness. I would get sent for the summers away from the family like the time with the Aunt that Loved Me, I do not think it was a good thing that you were more sophisticated the other children. A loving mother, would wonder what kind of influences and the rest you were under and would have snapped to attention especially with you being 13. They just don't care sadly and probably the more sophistication came from basically lacking a mother and knowing you had to learn about the world quick. I never was told anything so most of my information about the world was coming via books. There is a reason I read that motherless daughters book, and cried in my teens asking where was the book for me? We have to "mother" ourselves never having had a real one. Take care TW thanks so much for your kind words.

  7. my brother told me that "nobody like you" and yep couple of months later? Yeah, I let him use my credit to buy a big screen TV that he can't or wouldn't pay for. I was looking for crumbs of please like me.

    Years before when my sister said I wasn't high on her list of priorities . I just took it in.
    When she said I'm really just coming down to visit Mom after I said I'm looking forward to your visit...I just took it in. When I called her on what she said to me and she replied I never said that ... it made me think that this is so not right.- Erin

    1. Yes the crumbs of "please like me" can set us up for disaster. Sorry you got stuck with the TV. If you live local maybe you should just go get it since you are on the hook for it. Yes some of my narcs would basically tell me I wasn't high on their list of priorities. In my last NC letter, I wrote if you slam a door in someone's face enough times, what do they do if they have any self respect they walk away. I feel happier not having "to work" on any of these relationships. The low contacts are getting the minimal. I haven't seen them all in 10 years so why push myself? Erin, I hadn't seen my brother in 6 years, and he went to visit my mother when he lives way out of state and was in a short drive from me, and he refused to come here. She wanted to take every minute of his time. She told him, "you don't have time to visit her". He didn't show up and I never have forgotten that. It hurts but the same thing happens to me. I'm not going to expend energy to see my brother. Even if I had money and health for a long trip, why bother at this point? He doesn't even know me anymore. So yes I too got the "I'm coming to see Mom line and we will be too busy". They always put her way ahead of me. Well she had money too.

  8. I'm not an ACON, my family had plenty of other dysfunction that mean they are not safe to be around. I think if you can go "no contact" with family it sets a very good boundary that can be applied wherever it is needed.

    You are right that we are trained (groomed?) to fit a certain role in any relationship be that at work, a friendship or an intimate relationship. We are taught to put others first - especially if they are the demanding, controlling, confrontational sort of person similar to the ones who trained us.

    My FOO set me up for some horrific relationships and friendships because I was taught I DID NOT MATTER and should always bend over backwards to please and help others. They turned me into a servant/social worker for the use of others.

    It was only after I met my husband and made some real friends that things started to change and the blinkers I had been made to wear came off. No contact with FOO and removed a lot of other toxic people from my life.

    I love your blog. Thank you.

    1. I am glad you are staying away from the other dysfunction of your family. yes some have dysfuncton where one should leave even if it is not being an ACON. Yes they groomed us and trained us for certain roles in relationships.

      I became too much of the "pleaser" and "please like me". I ran into way too many narcs. I also realized I put up with people who just threw me crumbs and did not consider me a real priority in their lives. When you are always pushed behind others, it's time to wake up and ask yourself what you are investing in. It's not a real friendship. I'm not talking where a friend who is a mother needs time and attention for children or anything like that but when you get the door slammed in your face and time and time again. So YES I was there too and set up for some horrific friendships in my case, and was taught to be always giving even as people treated me like crap and had absolutely no loyalty. All the people I kicked to the curb were people who treated me like my family and honestly while I feared the social loneliness one really is more alone when dealing with these type of people.

      I have some real friends who were the voices in the wilderness too against the narcissits, and helped to wake me up. No contact yes too as you see is having me clean out the toxics. Thanks regarding my blog :)

  9. I'm glad you did a grand clean out for the past three years. I know it was not easy to do, especially with friends and relatives whom you thought were supportive and caring people. I had to do the same myself. There were some older adults who betrayed me since I learned about malignant and covert narcissism in 2013. I might have to ignore them in the future and give my time and energy to those who are reaching out to me, and those who have been supportive all along.

    I also noticed that some ex-friends from a "normal family" might be narcs too. There had been reasons that I confronted them in the past and they chose to cut me off after I confronted them for judging me or treating me unfairly.

    I'm sorry you feared loneliness but you will get more real friends over the time. I don't have a husband but gained good friends over the years. I'm glad you have a good, supportive husband who has been there with you for years and stuck with you after you went NC. You're lucky to have him as a friend and a husband.

    I used to fear loneliness too because my adopted narc mother used to tell me that I will be a very lonely old lady if I don't do this, this, or this. I realized she wanted me to have friends and a husband who were more like her: very critical, cruel, cold, self-righteous, anti-family values, fans of "tough love" or "bitter pill," and mockers of those who are in a loving relationship. I did not want to be with these people and did not want to wait until I find somebody in order to have fun. I started eating out and going to movies alone. Sometime I found somebody to do fun things with and did not have to wait for them. They usually invited me to enjoy them. Sometime I invited them to join me. Looking back, I noticed that people started to invite me to join them several years after I went NC.

    I had to get rid of traitors over the years and had been upset with these people. Some people dumped me because I did not have money to give to them. Some dumped me for confronting them for judging me or for being mean to unfortunate people. One lady dumped me after we both moved out of a town in Washington State. We said "Good-bye" before I left a town but never heard from her again. I did not like something she said about God, church, and abusive Christians and we had some rifts about it over the time.

    Being around with toxic people like your narc friends or relatives are not worth your time and energy. We will get lonely for it, but our health and happiness come first before their narc supplies from us. The worst thing could happen to us is that somebody or some social services could try to force us to come back to our abusers for money or documents we need. It happened to me in the past. Now, I am past my 40s so the society stopped expecting me to ask my "parents" for money and for things that could help us to survive. As an adult with disability, we will need good advocates so we will not get forced to contact our narcs for survival.

    I will pray for you and your husband. Hope you will have a great holidays seasons.

    1. Thanks anon, I know it has been intense and not that easy to do. As I wrote the family left me, but with the other relationships they were never there either in any real way. The long distance one who acted like we were "best friends" and then who wouldn't even come see me after hours a week on the phone, I am glad I got a clue there and how I was being used for narcissistic supply and in a way I didn't even "exist" to her.

      It can be scary for many to go NC even with the original FOO, because of the fears of "being alone" in this world. Because of being disabled, this kept me in the game far longer then I would have been and in the fog I was blind to many things that were apparent like when I was in the hospital so sick in my 20s and 30s even for three weeks at a time how none of them would show up. That should have been a clue long long ago but I understand why I didn't see it learning about narcissistic abuse.

      I have no interest in the fix-in queens and the others who used me to elevate themselves. I agree we have to be careful who we let into our lives. I want people who are REAL and willing to risk vulnerability and who have stepped out of everything being a contest and competition. Ones who believe in the system and it's evils, and have no suspicions that something is wrong also are to be avoided.
      One thing many will cut you off, I have learned the narcs can't take a hint of criticism and most will make sure a "friendship" ends if there is any confrontation especially if you demand decent treatment or refuse to play the role they have tried to shove you into. I have good real friends now but am hoping I find more and some local. It can be a scary process.

      I am glad you have good friends. I am fortunate for my husband. We are definitely best friends too. He stuck by me in thick and thin. I understand why I fell in love with him more and more from the start and grew to love him more.


    2. My narc mother used loneliness and my Aspie troubles against me too. She would tell me no one liked me and I would die lonely. I think she set things up for me not to have people around me, the smear campaigning but this also described the extreme strictness of high school and how and why I wasn't allowed to go anywhere. This happens to a lot of ACONs. Sometimes my mother would rub the number of friends she had in my face and point out I had none and then in the next breathe tell me I couldn't stay for a school club or anything because she wouldn't help me with a ride there or I had more housework to do.

      I noticed too with time that most of our family friends and the relatives who spent a lot of time with my mother and parents never seemed to have any empathy for me, and they were all high achiever types who were critical, cold, self righteous, made a great play of being "religious"-church going, considered the poor, welfare and other races to be below them etc.

      They pushed the "tough love" junk too and were not affectionate people. Examining my mother friends, she befriended a few vulnerables where she'd dump them like the one who got sick she had no use for but a lot were just as cold as her and always ended up on top.

      Many of her friends would back up how she treated me and say I deserved it because I was "FAT". [thinking of her one lady who was a next door neighbor and family friend for 30 years, and another next door neighbor and friend and a multitude of others] My mother never had a friend who was outside of her social class or race in her life either.

      I am glad you took care of yourself and ate out alone and did movies alone. I did that when single and even shopped alone in my last town after marriage while husband was working and a bit more mobile. Driving was safer there since the town was so small and less populated. I am glad you could see a healing in your social life, after you went NC and had good friends come.

      I think when our energy is being given to the narcs and traitors, there is less energy for the good people. We can make more time for good people when we clean the decks so to speak. Onde thing I am doing is not pushing myself socially as much, and realizing as a woman with such severe disabilities, it is okay to have a lot of social interactions be online and not to force myself to social events during non-"housebound" times, just because I think I "should". I know a lot of that is rooted in that desperate feeling I had, and my mother abusing me by telling me no one liked me and to prove her wrong. A lot of people were wiped away that are in many people's lives from simply not having a family who loved and cared about me.

      I am glad you got away from people who used you and were not nice. I think we were all alone around the toxics. This is something that has occurred to me, after being NC and the rest, things did not feel different in that way. I was alone around them. They refused to "see" me, I wrote that in the earlier years of NC on this blog and how true it was. Also you know how you try to reach out and love people, narcs can't receive love or attention or knowing either.

      I think social services, counselors and more should step up and know more about these forms of abuse so we aren't told to reconcile with abusive families or get documents. Young people should be taught how to get their own SSD card, birth certificate and more. I wiggled out a bad copy with an edge cut off of my own certificate during my first NC. [I had to use this for adoption search and it is kind of a weird certificate] Yes in the 40s especially late, many people will assume your parents are even deceased so a lot of those pressures are gone. There definitely needs to be more protections in place for disabled people who have abusive families and we do need advocates too.

      Happy holidays to you too. Wishing you a Happy New Year as well. :)