Friday, October 14, 2011

Only The Positive Side of Fatness Can Be Discussed?

I knew size acceptance was bad with the censorship even years ago, but didn't know how hard and fast their ideological rules held or had grown over the ten years, I was totally detached from their world. I found this written about my blog. She had commented on that other blog in dispute with my own.

I have realized most likely I will be avoiding all size acceptance blogs, why bother if talking to these people is like talking to brick walls? I will still be on the outlook for fellow independent thinkers.

If anyone who is in my size category reads this blog, please honestly look at what I have faced, they do not want you in their movement, you disprove their false theories. Actually given I stand against discrimination against the overweight, their incredible block-headed positions that refuse to "LISTEN" have been astounding. I am ok with people who are happy to be fat, who never want to go on a diet again but explaining things from my perspective, is a perspective, they want nothing to do with. I often have said sometimes the worse hatred for the super-sized person, can come from the midsized crowd, and while I have friends of all sizes from the extremely thin to even at or near the weights I have been, you meet the types, who fear being you. You represent their deepest fears, thus the automatic loathing, anger and more. I know this is true in the hyper-radical circles of size acceptance. The claims of "you only think of yourself"--the world doesn't revolve around YOU, is just more distraction.

Let's begin addressing her points:

Every now and then, someone will make the rounds of FA blogs and basically criticize fat acceptance for being fat acceptance. They want to talk about how much they hate being fat. They want to discuss a cure for obesity that doesn’t involve dieting or surgery. They don’t BLAME fat people, of course. They just want them to stop being fat because it obviously is an unhealthy, unhappy existence. They want to talk about the “other side” of obesity.

It is interesting she mentions this as a recurring theme. I suppose they have driven off fat people like myself they wish to silence or well refuse to listen to. I guess I live an odd life, in that I can have interesting conversations with people on the liberal to the conservative spectrum, I guess I do not get this new American tendency to shut out those who do not fit your specific demographic but these women, seem even unable to engage. Their immediate reaction is to say, GO AWAY!, hands slapped over both ears. Now why is that? Where have I EVER said I want anyone to stop being fat as if I dream of a dystopian world of thin-only people? That is hyperbole to the max. As I wrote on another blog entry what is wrong with a cure? None of them ever answered that. Strange how they never have an answer to such questions.

No I do not blame fat people but obviously this person BLAMES me, for not being the super-healthy, extremely happy fat icons she only accepts in her inner circle. That is yet another level of extreme hypocrisy. As I have said on this blog, if you are dealing with severe obesity, your very existence threatens their whole fat acceptance house of sticks.

Our culture is full of opportunities of discuss the “other side” of obesity.

Where? Is she telling me I have to slink back to the diet mongers and fat haters, because I will not drink the fat acceptance Kool-Aid, slap a smile on my face and hide the truth? Is that what she desires of anyone who speaks the truth about fat? I have to pick one side of the other? Where on the web matches this blog?

That “other side” of obesity is all that really gets discussed.

Where? There are things I discuss on this blog that have been discussed nowhere else.

It is fat acceptance that is the “other side” of obesity. Because of the near total opposition to our ideas, we have created safe spaces to discuss the positive side of being fat, how to live a satisfying life while fat, and advocating for fat rights as we are.

Ironic how she brings up safe spaces, safe spaces with bars on the windows, maybe... I can address that, pretty bluntly. I am a very large woman, I agree with them about being against the discrimination and functioning at your best while fat, but WHAM, down comes the boom for my other viewpoints regarding obesity or even sharing factual aspects of my life. By the way, she can try to portray me as a woeful victim that should be shoved over the shining fat happy people boat but I am not. This is why I can confront these people in these lies. I am not the type to slink off, and say, "Oh I am sorry." No, I am not sorry for sharing my experiences, or for questioning the status quo.

We discuss what it is like to be fat as well as [insert intersectional identity here]. Yet even this is too much for people opposed to FA. We do not do enough to talk about the “other side” of obesity.

What is "intersectional identity"? Sometimes this liberal new academic speak escapes me. I discuss what it is like to be fat at the higher weights, and she does not like it. She wants it hidden? Why? One thing about this blog, being this weight and stepping out to admit what it is really like is not easy. The world screams at you to go back in your hole and shut up! Well these fat acceptance denizens are the leaders of that.

Well, guess what. That’s not what we do. That’s not what we’re about.

So what are you about? Certainly not being welcoming to people of all sizes of fat.

From what I can tell you are about imposing censorship, control of free speech, thought control, dumbed down thinking, and more disrespect towards those who are in the higher weights.

If you want to do that, go someplace else. FA is not for you, apparently,

Well she is right, FA is not a movement for me, it has become a movement of hyper-liberal elitist radicals from what I can tell who care nothing about the opinions, lives, feelings or realities of those they pretend to represent. If she thinks her arrogant support in the sending me off from that other blog, speaks well for her FA movement, it does not. In fact, it only helps my theory, that FA remains a small exclusive, rejected movement because of these traits.

and there is nothing I can do about that. But I am not oppressing you by not allowing you to hijack my blog for a purpose to which I am opposed.

She can't handle one disagreement? What purpose is that? Does she even know what my purpose is? She seems to miss that by a mile. I want real help and support for fat people, not a bunch of "Up with Fat" nonsense brokers.

For the record, you do not HAVE to like being fat, disabled, or anything else you happen to be.

Who on the planet would like being over 500lbs? Who on the planet would like being disabled? thin or fat? I would like to ask that of her friend too over on Fat Heffalump? Isn't she angry over the fact that I am questioning the whole be happy about being fat paradigm? It just doesn't fit for all of us.

You don’t have to agree with me or any other FA blogger. You don’t have to do anything, and it’s not my job to live your life for you. I provide options and alternative views. It’s not about “oppressing” you.

Hey she can say and do what she wants. I have the right to ban anyone I do not want from this blog too, and yes it is my life. I have the freedom to say she and those like her are WRONG.

But at least I live my life free not letting others tell me what to say, do and be. Their censorship of fat people speaks for itself.

I am glad I left the fat acceptance movement. This is total evidence of what it has become. Where is the acceptance in fat acceptance? Only perky younger midsized women who have good health need apply who can sing the praises of fat to each other and live in delusion land. Now what is interesting is how closed they are to any other opinions.

I have realized engagement with these folks, is a waste of time, so dear reader, you probably will not hear of any more personal battles with them, but I will still write against the two sided set of lies when it comes to obesity. By the way I am not the first one who has encountered this, they do ban anyone [fat or thin] who questions their theories.

Even on the Dead of Winter blog, looks like I am not the first she has pushed for the delusions they remain entrenched:

I have said it before and I will say it again. Fat does not cause health or mobility problems, so curing fat would do no good. We could make all fat people thin, or at least less fat, and the health issues would remain. Even if it did, we cannot make people permanently thin in a safe way.

I have realized some today are just unable to think.



    I think here she is being honest at least....

    "Planet Fat Acceptance has a sun around which it revolves, and it is acceptance of fat. Simple, no?"

    "Acceptance of fat."

    **Notice she said not acceptance of FAT PEOPLE.***

    Continued arguing will be fruitless, the only thing to do when you face a "cult" [even one of political persuasions] is to just get away from it.

    I know to these people my experiences mean nothing obviously, but in this world, I do not expect to be friends with everyone.

    Part of my life happiness is being able to be honest and own my experiences and emotions. They denied me that on their blogs. Their choice. My problem is all the fat people who will be hurt, who will know unless they *ACCEPT FAT* too, that they are not wanted.

    Thin Desire you were on to something, it is all about the FAT and fetishization of it.

    My theory that fat acceptance as now practiced by the majority is a false socio-political movement to serve as the inverse side of the coin to the industrial diet complex, has been even more proven.

  2. She wrote:

    "Obesity is not a bad thing or a disease *in itself* and that obesity has advantages."

    I guess that is the "rule" I broke.

    Notice too the emphasis on SAFE, she repeats that word several times. Ideas are *dangerous* I suppose in fat acceptance.

    It would be nice if PEOPLE were stressed and not the FAT itself.

    More objectification, more disconnection for people in modern society.

  3. I understand where you are coming from as I also believe there is a lot of fingers being jammed in ears saying, "la, la, la, I am not listening" when it comes to health and weight. There is a fair bit of intellectual disingenuousness going on and denial that being fat can create health issues (either now or down the road).

    However, when you politicize and say things like, "it has become a movement of hyper-liberal elitist radicals", then you undermine your viewpoint and credibility. The political orientation of the people in fat acceptance is not the issue and when you make it one, you come across as someone who is more interested in labeling than putting forth a cogent argument about the true consequences of living at a high weight. These types of statements are nothing more than ad hominem attacks, and make it hard to take you seriously.

    If you want a voice in their pulpit, then you have to respect them enough to deal with their arguments without resorting to name calling or politicizing. If you can't respect them, they won't respect you.

  4. I have friends who are progressives and liberals as well as the other side, but I do see a lot of the nonsense of fat acceptance coming out of the extreme hyper-liberal world where it's all idealogue, and rhetoric, not based on reality, even the emphasis on the BODY above all else comes from extremes of those perspectives. So in the movement itself there is huge degree of politicizing. Perhaps I should made it more clear this not apply to all who hold "progressive", more liberal viewpoints, I myself am an independent so perhaps this was misleading. I feel fat acceptance has very radical agendas that do not even speak to the average person, even the odd use of a new vocabulary, like "embodiment" and "intersectionality of identities", I am asking myself Who are they kidding? So I really do see the movement as having partnered up with *extreme* social-liberal agendas. There is a degree of classism and elitism in size acceptance too, I encountered it first hand, so that one we probably will disagree on. I no longer want a voice in their pulpit, there many be a few independent minded types I wouldn't mind correspondence with, but I am done, it is their politicizing you see that was the problem to begin with. I am glad you do admit it was a finger in the ears moment where they went la la la. Webwide, I have realized I am not alone in my feelings that it is an extreme movement that will remain on the fringes for many obvious reasons. Sad to say there are probably some decent people who want to stand up for fat people but who are silenced by the radicals and forced to adhere to their fat acceptance "rules". I do think the rejection of reality, is one of their biggest problems. I have seen others like myself sent away with their own experiences and reality denied, which tells me these people [I am talking about the vocal militant fat activists] do not have an agenda that matches my own.

    I think things went bad when NAAFA changed it's name.

    Sometime around 1980, NAAFA changed its name from National Association to Aid Fat Americans to National Association to Advance Fat Acceptance

    It used to be about FAT *PEOPLE*, now its all about promoting the FAT itself.

    Their arguments to me are non-scientific, rejecting the reality I [and many others] have lived--foisting a voicelessness upon me I will not tolerate and about an agenda that does not really have the best interests of fat people behind it. In fact it will only lead to more rejection of overweight people in the inverse. I know they do not respect me, I have beliefs that challenge their own, and sadly it is probably mutual from both sides. The damage being done? More silenced fat people, more go to the back of the room, we don't want to hear you. What is ironic, is they are even worse then the fat haters and discriminators they claim to stand up against.

  5. I have mixed feelings about this; I liked your post and the comments but when you started going into politics, liberalism, etc I kind of zoned out.

    That is not what I thought FA was about, I consider FA to be about challenging the way society looks at fat people and how people think, to help them accept that fat people are here and are happy (for the most part) and that discrimination and bullying are in NO WAY acceptable any more.

    I thought FA was about changing the way the fashion industry thinks about the models it uses and the way designers think about making clothes for women of average size and above and not only for the women on their catwalks.

    I thought it was about helping the health industry realise that health is relative, that there are healthy fat people and that 'you have to lose weight' is not the answer to all their problems (as my doctor obviously thinks so). I am 277lbs, I have no big health problems aside from an underactive thyroid well controlled with medication and occasional bouts of sciatica. However, I do have problems, my knees are weak, I cannot stay on my feet for long periods of time, etc but these are minor.

    Although I am happy with my weight, like my body as it is and do not diet, I do watch what I eat enough to STAY at the weight I am and not gain, because I know that I will have health problems if I gain. I don't agree that I live in 'delusion land'.

    However, I agree with you on the apparent cut-off point that FA seems to have, I have a blog on Tumblr and am following a few FA bloggers and they all come up on my dashboard. I notice with dismay that most of the people showcased on these blogs are in the size 18-22 range which, being a size 26, is disheartening. Nothing is mentioned about people over this size.

    I believe that FA's would double it's credibility if it accepted that, yes, there are fat people out there that are not happy, that suffer from health conditions that ARE related to their weight and that losing said weight would help them immensely and they would be happy! Isn't that what it's all about? People being HAPPY with their weight, whatever that weight may be?

    I agree with you that FA does not accept all sizes of peep.

    I love your blog, I will continue to read it, but I think leaving and denouncing the FA movement is a little drastic, like their denouncing of you is also drastic. I think more discussion needs to be had about this and that you need to accept the FA POV of happiness with weight and trying to change the world but that FA needs to accept your (and others) POV of being the size that you are and having the health problems that you do and needing to change your weight accordingly.

    I apologise if this doesn't make much sense, I kind of wrote it off the cuff in response and I do tend to ramble and I'm sorry if I've got any of my facts a little wrong.

    Blessed be

  6. Thanks for sharing your thoughts Sallie. Sorry if the politics make you zone out. I am not a Republican either if that helps you feel better. I do think some of the crazy language like ebodiment and concepts in fat acceptance is coming out of the extremes of liberal academia. We probably do not have to agree on this to have a civil discussion though. I have no problems with the refusing discrimination and hatred part of the FA movement. We definitely agree there, even regarding parts of fashion and health and the health industry. I am glad you are more realistic, knowing that in your case and for your health you have to be careful not to gain. that fits a lot of people. I have noticed too that many of the very vitrolic fat acceptance folks, are in the 18-22 category so far smaller, and also younger, mostly all in their 20s. So yeah we have noticed the same thing here. Even when I was more midsized and in my case that meant size 24-26 [at almost 6 feet tall] usually, I remember feeling that way too.

    I think FA has lost credibility too promoting fat above people and not dealing realistically what weight does to a life at higher sizes. Thanks for admitting that. So all sizes of people are not accepted. Hey us people who live in the outlines of weight, know our outcast status [in a variety of places] is pretty cemented in this culture. Sad that it has to include the groups, that want as a price our dishonesty to be joined in. I won't do that. Thanks for the compliments regarding my blog.

    Well I do think I am outside the FA movement, at this point whether I had made an "official leaving" or not. The constant bannings and more, and even one lady who thought I was a phony troll said it all. Now I will stand against the diet industrial complex and demand changes for fat people and stand against fat hatred, so whatever category people put this blog will be their choice, but I and mainstream FA obviously do not see eye to eye at all.

    I can accept that there are midsized people who are happy and can live a robust life in higher weights. Have no problem with that. You are right they need to accept what someone like me is facing. I'd be already dead if I had stayed at the peak weight years ago.

    Thanks for your response.