Monday, December 1, 2014

With the Very Few I am in Contact with

"The narcissist is able to subvert every member of a family"

One good thing about this video is he brings up the issue of how we are not believed and how entire families to far flung cousins and aunts will be turned against the scapegoat. He is right about narcissists being "perception crafters". I am glad the Bible warns about these type of people subverting entire families. Most of the world does not understand how this can happen.

I know I have to be careful and protect myself.

I can see things ebbing away. I don't want to try anymore to fix dead end relationships. Some may be able to stay acquaintances of mine on Facebook, others I know I have little more to say to them.

When I went No Contact, I went no contact with around 16 people in my family. So when I say there is only a few left.....

With a few young ones, such as one niece who has written me, I pray and try to have hope, but I know the family system surrounds and trains all of them. I have noticed in the letters she writes me, she seems afraid to go too deep. She doesn't answer direct questions. She refuses to share her Instagram link with me that she mentioned. What is the big deal in sharing it?  I don't know if her email is read by her parents or not so it may not be her fault. She may have been told not to share it.  I keep the letters friendly and polite but have noticed this even on small matters.

Ollie Matthews once warned of keeping company with those who keep company with our abusers. He is correct about this. They do hurt you. I don't want to be hurt anymore.

Even with my kind cousins, the grown children of the "Aunt that Loved Me", the narcissistic net surrounds them. They spent Thanksgiving with the uncle that directly insulted me before I went no contact. His wife is Aunt Denial who teamed up with my mother to keep me from family events for years.

This is the uncle who trashed me overtly for being poor on Facebook, the one who is the favorite brother of my mother. I told one of them how he treated me, and even though this cousin is otherwise nice to me, he ignored this. He didn't want to hear it and in a response to a letter skipped that topic. That uncle recently is getting closer with all three of them, inviting them to dinners and hanging out with them on a continuous basis. I find myself thinking this is the guy who would run and smash my face into the ground when I would go on family visits as child. This is the guy who wrote, that "all poor people are lazy bums", on Facebook when my husband has faced lay-off problems. What on earth do they see in this guy? Why is he suddenly paying so much attention to them?

As I wrote in another post, I'm not sending a nephew any more cards after this last one unless there is a response. I haven't spoken with him since 2012. I gave him an email address and he has full internet access. He is 16, I know an age where many boys are busy and not thinking of an aunt, but why send any more cards and letters only to be ignored? He has refused to befriend me on Facebook.

I have a pit in my stomach, I've realized about ANY of my relatives. This includes the cousins. Does it makes sense that I feel betrayal for their love of my abusers and loyalty to them? They all have contact with my mother too though they only see her at occasional family gatherings.

 I notice in all the letters, everything is parceled out, they ignore my questions in general or points. I'm not laying it on thick, and trying to focus on the "good stuff". A couple years ago, I asked to befriend one's child on Facebook who is 14, and he said, "That is my ex-wife's department, you can ask her." I was turned down, she is friends with my mother. These kind of things hurt. I never had one harsh word with his ex-wife. Never. That was the work of my mother.

 The cousins are polite and nice to me but holding me at extreme arm's length. A few of these side relatives I told them how bad the abuse was, and how even when sick, how my immediate family rejected me, but there they would remain silent. They refused to discuss these issues. A couple admitted that my mother responded to my adoption questions very strangely but that was it. Otherwise,  they seemed afraid of even writing one mild question about my mother or criticism. They are growing closer with my abusers, it worries me. With one cousin, I was helping him find a book, and he seemed surprised I would take the time. That was kind of weird. He spoke of a book, his mother read to him as a child. His mother was loving, mine was not. I was never read to not once as a child.

 Inside emotionally they just represent rejection to me. I had some hope for the younger ones, but even with that, I just don't want to try anymore. I am tired of "proving" myself to people. I just do not want to do it anymore. The one niece who writes me seems to care and I do her, but even there I feel sadness knowing they will be doing everything in their power to lead her away. The sense of loss can be overpowering.

With my brother, I have gone even more limited contact. He called me on Thanksgiving, but I could tell the phone call was different. He remembered me, but I didn't expend much energy as he bragged about all his holiday shopping, yes he knows in my case, there is no money for any shopping,  and I got off the phone very quickly.

 I want to protect myself more, and I am not expending energy on these relationships anymore but the bare minimum, even there, I know I will have to address the pit in my stomach I have dealing with any of them and how much in some integral way outside of the youngest how they all disappoint me so much.  Some of these relationships will be coming to an end too. I already know it. The me of today would rather be alone then grovel before anyone. If they don't believe me and support my abusers and visit them all the time and are closer to them what future can there be?

Inside I do feel betrayed, I can't help it. The relationships probably have little future. Unlike close friends where I can share feelings, and deep thoughts, here, I am always blocked. They all hold me at arm's length for the sake of my abusers. Here I have to take my own advice, "Don't go to empty wells!"

When Scapegoats Are Ostracized By An Entire Family


  1. It's good you are reaching out to the younger generation. You are such a brave soul. I worry too about those nieces I have. I'm pretty sure at least one of my nieces is an ACON. I saw her mother (my brother's wife) with the smirk, feeding on her emotions once. And I feel so bad for not standing up to it.

    If she is an ACON she is a young ACON and can imagine her in 30 years putting up a blog right after her awakening. You know where I'm going with this? I feel so bad.

    My brother's wife is one of the scariest narcs around. My brother insists she is just the type to "Not put up with anyone's crap". But she is worse than that. I know it.

    Just wanted to say you are one brave lady. Reaching out to the younger generation. They won't have you to blame for doing so.

    1. Thanks. I am trying to reach out to them. I may have failed with them all but at least my conscience will be clear. I am noticing that none are like me, none are going down a "new path" so to speak. I have to admit I am kind of disappointed by this. I am sorry your niece is suffering. I think one of my nieces could be a scapegoat, but they are grooming her and being "nice" I think to keep her from me for now. I hope she puts up a blog one da and can escape. Yes they do the smirking thing feeding on emotions. Speaking of narc wives, watch a Joan Crawford movie to see the men scrape and bow before narcs and shove nicer women aside, I was watching one yesterday from 1940 called Susan and God. The woman was an obvious narc but she wins the man back. Ugh. What a bad movie. I wonder if there was predictive programming to help the narcs out. Joan Crawford was acting as herself--think Mommie Dearest.

      Your brother definitely sounds like he is in the fog. Thanks for saying I am brave. I hope there will be some who see through the nonsense like me one day.

  2. What a spineless clan! I'm glad I cut everyone in my adoptive family off when I went NC with my main narc abuser years ago. I don't think there are anything you could do that would help you to get better responses from your cousins, nieces, and nephews. They made their choices to to be with narcs rather than with real people.

    The answers they gave you are bunches of empty wells and fillers. Ugh. Hope you will have a great start of the new years with people who appreciates you.

    1. I agree they are spineless. They treated me like I am radioactive and I'm sick of it. I am glad you cut them off. It sickens me how they always cared about pleasing the narcs and treated me like yesterday's trash. Aunt Clueless and my Cousin chose my mother who isn't even blood related to them. I think there are narcs in directing things too. Yes a lot of empty wells and empty politeness. I do have friends who appreciate me, so that is good among all this.

  3. Dear Sister Peep, thank you for posting my video. Please know your writing is such a blessing to me, and has been for many months. You are one of my must reads.

    I come from a family of overt narcs, and have been no contact with them since 2003.

    I began dating my wife in 1994. We married a couple of years later. She comes from a family of covert narcs, and are really, really good at it. Whereas my parents "mask" does not veer far at all from their true character - Rush Limbaugh comes to mind - my wife's parents play the role of pious christian.

    My wife's two children from a previous marriage, a son and daughter, were adopted by me when they were 6 and 7 years old respectively. Both regard my wife in lieu of the scapegoat role her parents (their grandparents) relegated to their daughter. The girl is outright malicious toward my wife, and has been since she was young. The boy is polite toward my wife, but any real respect for her opinion or feelings on anything of substance is nonexistent.

    Grandpa and Grandma yield great influence on my wife's side of the family, probably due to their financial situation (not rich, but worth a million easy) which they use to influence the clan.

    Wife and I didn't stand a chance. We're lower middle class working people who prefer a quiet lifestyle. Grandpa and Grandma live in the wealthiest section of the county, and have plenty of "toys" with which to impress, and sway. My wife's GC brother and GC sister, who lead not so quiet lifestyles, are more like parents to our kids than we, and have been for years.

    We have NOBODY on either side of the family to confide in. Our 27 year old daughter scares the spit out of us - we believe she's capable of anything - and relations with our son are polite, cordial, and painfully superficial.

    You are not alone. I don't have words to express the pain I feel for what you are going through. All I can tell you is my wife and I are in your corner. You are my dear sister in Christ who I love and respect very, very much.

    My wife is the most beautiful, gentle, generous and talented woman you'll ever meet, and it's obvious to anyone who takes the time to get to know her. Yet these monsters treat dog feces better than her.

    Your talent, wisdom, insight and humor simply shines through your writing. I can feel the love you have for truth, and for God. Which is why I shake my head in disbelief at how your fecal matter for brains family treat you. But alas, I see this same thing with my wife.

    I can almost hear the Spirit say: Their loss! My gain!

    I can hear my own heart exclaim: Their loss! Our gain! Your ministry has encouraged me countless times.

    I pray in the Name above all names for His Grace to abound toward you in the financial realm, and that speedily. Be blessed Sister Peep!

    1. Hi Brother Smakintosh, I am glad I found your videos and plan to watch more of them. I watched the one where you talked about their morality being darkened too and it was very good. I totally agree. I am glad you went NC with an overt narcisstic family. One reason I went NC is God tells us to depart from the wicked. I am happy to hear you have been reading my blog already and have enjoyed the articles.

      I am glad you found your wife who sounds like she is an ACON too. Some of the narcs yes are far more "good" at the false masks then others. While some do not lay on the charm and false veeners, others do. The ones who can wear the masks are in some ways more dangerous. My mother lays on the "pious Catholic" act, and even once on Facebook claimed she was born again. I know that is not true. I believe Revelation 17 when it comes to Rome.

      I am sorry your wife's grandparents unduly influenced her children who you adopted too, and turned them against your wife and you. I hear this all the time and in other places where the narcissistic grandparents will turn children against their own normal non-narcisstic parents. They will often use money to do this. Yes some will be polite but will ignore and invalidate you. I have those types in my family who will be "nice" but nothing is there. It sounds like grandpa and grandma operate the same as my mother who has the money to "buy" people. I know poverty kept me in far longer then I should have been knowing a chance of a more secure life with a possible inheritance though there was some evidence I had been cut out and one aunt told me this years earlier. I prayed the week before I went NC, and God answered my prayer directly. They will use these money and wills to control. My narc father whenever he got angry at me and my brother, would rewrite the will, and once told us he had given the GC 85% and my brother and me 15%. That was sick.''

      My mother definitely owns the family, paying for trucking school for one cousin, providing job connections that were denied to me. So I understand how you and your wife didn't stand a chance against this stuff. Sadly too many sell out for mammon. With me too, they had toys and fun and vacations to impress with. I was ostracized before NC for being poor, I am of the lower echelon in America--somewhere above homelessness. LOL, but we were working class for many years, and they would reject my apartment telling me it was too small or the children didn't have a place to play etc. I am sorry the GC aunt and uncle got in on the action too and influenced your wife's and your adoptive children away from you. I see that in my family system too, with the uncles and aunts and others helping to cement the position of the narcs. I was in my mother's house a few years ago and saw where a cousin who refused to befriend me on FB wrote, "My Aunt ****, My Hero" as an essay for school.



    2. I am in the same place you are there is no body in my family to confide in. I was attempting with my brother but he folded and sold me out immediately. Yes listen to those feelings about your 27 year old daughter, I am sorry things are superficial with your son. I feel that way too, with the nice ones and cousins there is this forced superficiality. They only write back in the bare minimum and say as little as possible. People become strangers sadly over the long haul with that kind of dynamic.

      Thanks for your kind and encouraging words. It has helped me a lot to meet other people facing these things. Thanks for understanding how deep the pain here can go. Your wife sounds like a wonderful woman as well. I am glad you have each other. My husband has been of support for what I have gone through as well. She does not deserve how they have treated her. Having one's own children even turn away has to be pain I can't describe either. Thanks for your compliments regarding my writing and love for God and truth. :) I believe God helped lead me into truth about this family and I continue to pray for His help and comforts.

      I know I found myself thinking why did they toss me under the bus, I'm not a bad person. I am sure watching what has happened to your dear wife, you wonder how could they treat her this way. I believe these people do choose their wickedness. Psalm 73 sums up their final destiny if they do not repent so yes the Spirit will say their loss, my gain. I am glad I have been able to encourage you. I want to watch more of your videos and your wives and glad I found them.

      Thanks so much for your prayers, I will pray for you and your wife, God bless.

  4. I'm feeling you Peep as the other ACONS here do as well. I come from a large Italian family, youngest of seven kids. My FOO was like an episode of Soprano's. Sunday pasta with your whole extended family was expected. My uncles wore gold Cruxifixes and wife beaters under velour track suits. All that history is G-O-N-E. Today, I'm married 15 yrs and have two children. I have contact with one brother who went NC going on 10 yrs (3 yrs for me). Two other brothers KNOW the truth but keep superficial ties with me only via email. Never hear from aunts, uncles, cousins, nieces, nephews. My NMom and her co-conspirator Nsister set the stage for this to happen via lies, slander couched as false concern, exploitation and manipulation. You would not believe the craziness, the outright lies they have gotten away with, how they systematically destroyed all natural bonds between me and father (now deceased) and the rest. Only one brother bears witness to their evilness, who happens to be a fellow scapegoat. His theory is that they get rid of those who love God. We are all starting over again, all of us. My biggest concern is for my children, and I just have to trust God that he will bring future mates and good in laws to replace what I lost family-wise. I wonder what their weddings will look like with maybe five people present from my side, while I know my NSis and her family, the golden ones, will have 150 extended family attend special life events like her children's weddings. The covert emotional, psychological and neglectful abuse will never be exposed. They got rid of two people who loved their family the most, who believed the Italian hyped that family is everything, the ones who gave the most time, money, and support. They know they took what was most dear to us and to our offspring.

    We moved to magical NYC recently. My husband is a subject matter expert in his field, an entrepreneur, and is a CEO before 40. His family comes from nothing, but he worked his tail off from high school to be where he's at today. We didn't have children until married 10 yrs b/c we both worked and saved. I thought when we hit success my family would love and accept me never happened.

    1. Thanks Anon, for saying you understand what I have gone through. LOL about the Sopranos. My FOO were not Italian but my father was from New Jersey and looked just like the top star of the Sopranos. I couldn't watch that show because of that. Add a few inches of height and more weight and that was my father. I used a picture in one of my articles of that guy to hint at what my father was like. So you had the old school stuff, with sunday pasta etc. How are things with you and the brother who went NC like you? Is he in agreement with you. I understand only keeping email communication, that will be it for me with a few. It looks like you had a wicked twosome operating against you and turning the family against you as well. Sigh, I know that is so hard.

      Sorry you lost natural bonds with my father. Yes my mother destroyed our relationship at a very young age. I even noticed in talking with my brother how much closer he was to my father though there was abuse there.

      I think your brother's theory that they get rid of those who love God is true. I was not a believer as a child or even until I was a young adult in my 30s, but I wanted to KNOW the truth and the Bible talks about those who have a love for the truth coming to know God. With your children do warn them. I do not want to see them influence them against you. Tell them what they are, when they are ready. I pray they marry into good families and have nice new families of their own that will replace some of the people you have lost. I know I am having to replace my family with friends and a church family.

      I agree all the covert stuff will never be exposed. I know even one day when they see this blog, the narcs will attempt to write me off as "crazy", they do not allow truth to come in via all their darkness.

      I am sure they lost out treating you and your brother so horribly. I am glad you and your husband have done well. I hope your fortunes continue and blessings. Thanks for telling me that success did not bring you love or acceptance either. I know I feel burdened by my poverty thinking they rejected me over it. This helps me know if that had not happened, it wouldn't have been any different.

  5. Ugh! I just entered my comment but neglected to check the right box and I think I lost my post. Don't you hate that? heart breaks for both you and smakintosh, who posted the video. What horrible people narcissists can be, and how awful to come from a family of them. These are people who have sold their soul and are ugly people inside without empathy.

    But you know what? It's not really your poverty, fatness, or what have you they hate. It's your empathy. All the other stuff is just a smokescreen to hide the fact they hate your humanity because they have lost theirs or never had it. N's envy and hate people who have empathy because it scares the daylights out of them. They're afraid you might "out" them, and that is exactly what you're doing. Good for you!

    They don't matter. What they think doesn't matter. You have your real family of friends who appreciate who you are inside and don't care about your finances, weight and all those other superficial things.

    FHPP knows all about my FOO and knows how similar our stories are. My MN mother has turned virtually everyone in the family against me--and I was a good kid!

    But it is what it is, and what they think doesn't matter. It still hurts though. It's hard not to envy those who have normal parents who love them and support them no matter what. But guess what? We're stronger because we have had this experience. And now we are helping others who have suffered too.

    FHPP--please email me at the email posted in "contact me" in my blog. I have something I want to say that I'm to embarrassed to and don't dare post on a public blog, but have to tell someone! Send me your email so I can tell you!

    1. Ok, I will write later today. :)

      I have to go get lunch after responding to comments but want to hear what you have to tell me.

      My heart breaks too for everyone who has gone through what we have. They do literally sell their souls for money and I believe to the narc system itself.

      I think they hate empathy too. Part of my abuse when they smacked me around was telling me. "You are too sensitive!"

      That definitely denotes empathy does it not?

      I always got the feeling they were dark people who hate the light like I talked about on the People of the Lie article.

      But you are right, I was abused during my thinner and more normal years. I was a good student, I had all the potentials of making real money and being successful and I was still abused. I was a quiet bookworm. I didn't cause anyone trouble. Yes our stories are very similar. We both were gentle feeling Aspies thrown in the shark pool!

      I struggle with the envy of those who have loving families. I could not have children and this made things even doubly painful. No family of my own. I pray to God to deal with some of this stuff. I am promised a real family in heaven.

      I agree we are stronger in many ways, it opened the door for me to see some truths about the world, and other things that may ot have happened for me.

      I hope to help others too as well. :) I know you are with your blog too and Smackintosh is too.

      Look for my letter later today.

  6. Of course you feel betrayed because you HAVE BEEN betrayed! These are the people who we're suppose to reify as "family" and they're anything *but* "family." You get tired of reaching out over and over again only to have your overtures at best ignored or most likely overtly rebuffed. Ouch!
    IMO, by the time we as the AC's start to recognize where the problem lies-and its not us-we've already been thoroughly slimed and maligned to other family members likely for years previously. Realizing you've been a dupe for years is a huge painful revelation. The implications are clear: No matter what you do or how hard you try, even in the face of overwhelming objective evidence to the contrary, you've been so successfully undermined by the NPs over such a long time you're not gonna be given a fair-if any-hearing. Nice, huh?
    As an aside, yesterday I celebrated the 30th anniversary of dropping my "See ya" note in the mail to my MN "mother." My life started getting better, a LOT better at that time. I only regret I allowed so many decades to pass and shed so many tears over the lack of relationship. I thought I deserved her abuse and neglect. So, if you can convince the VICTIM they deserve it, convincing other family members or community members is no challenge at all.
    And Peep, remember this: No matter how old we become, the NPs will not only have the vaulted title of "Parent," they'll also have the trump card of Age to extort unquestioning belief of their assertions to others about us. If I'm 70 and my MN "Mother" is 90 and an Alzheimer's patient, she'll STILL have MORE CREDIBILITY that I ever will!
    "Betrayed" IMO is a perfect description of a painful, relentless campaign wielded by the NP to annihilate their child-the unwitting, innocent victim of their evil. Yeah, I said it-EVIL. Diabolical. Murderers.

    1. Yes I have been betrayed, we all have been betrayed. I agree they do not act like family, some treat me more distantly then strangers on a bus or train. Even most of the "nice" ones never shared anything of themselves or personally. It got scary. There was always a wall there that the narcs built, and they refused to dismantle.

      I know I have reached the end of the road in reaching out. Deciding not to send the nephew any new cards is a new thing for me if I am ignored. I don't want to spend my life dealing with people who slam the door shut in my face. In my last NC letter I wrote, "What happens if you slam the door in someone's face enough times, if they have any self respect, they walk away!"

      When talking with a lot of them, Aunt Clueless and the rest, they all treated me like I was radioactive, they were scared of what I had to say, they never wanted the narcs to know they were too close to me, etc, so it was a flat out betrayal.

      Yes I am looking at 4 decades of her sliming me and brainwashing others behind the scenes. I think of the lies I did catch her in but there was much much more. I only saw the tip of the ice berg!

      I know I went out begging them for a fair hearing. To some I even described how narcissism worked with articles. I said directly I was smeared and abused. They didn't want to hear it. The cult members of the family clung to their high priestess with nary a independent thought.

      I agree since they can convince us we deserve it, doing it with others is no big deal. They pull a blinder over their eyes. Since the narcs refuse to "see" us, so do the others. Happy for your 30 years of NC.

      I feel sorry for the years of my youth and others suffering under these people's rejections and criticisms. I could have lost my life, if I even believed one lie, that I was so fat because it was my fault.

      Yes I noticed that dynamic too, of the PARENT. As I hid my mid-40s, it drove me crazy that they still seemed to hold this authority over me but have heard older people speak of how this worked and the word Parent always gives them this authority and place in society even though as a egg-donor they really never deserved the title as they never parented. Mine was always seen as more credible no matter what.

      I agree "betrayed" sums it up. One blogger calls them soul murderers and I agree. This is how evil operates with a mask and sadly many do not care for the truth and follow the most wicked in the room willingly and unquestioning. This describes my family.

      Thanks TW

  7. TW - I recall reading your comment once, how you and a friend were at a diner, and you saw a mean, smirking old lady walking back and forth, trying to get your attention. Then you realized it was your MN mother, whom you have been NC a very long time. That story still gives me chills. I've sen that same evil smirk on my mother too. Very creepy story. I love reading your comments TW.

    Peep - I know with my NM and NS, they are notorious party-throwers and gracious hostesses. My NS even hosted one of my brothwr's weddings on her large property, and did all the cooking, paying for the reception. You woukd think, "Wow, what a great sister." The truth is she has never uttered a kind word about my brother nor his first and now second wife. She would rip this sister-in-law apart behind their backs, and be so nice and charming to her face. It was disturbing to witness this hidden behavior. Even my mother-in-law said, "Wow, your mother and sister really doesn't like X" as they would gossip to my mother-in-law too, but then she would go home - 14 hours away not seeing how 2-face my NM and NS really were.

    This is what they do...they ingrain themselves into the lives of others, and really get others to love them, thus the flying monkey senior. They use seduction and charm via their false personas. They get others to depend on them not b/c they are altruistic, kind-hearted people just the opposite. It's all about control. They want to be able to sick these duped idiots on those who know the truth about them - ACONS/scapegoats. They take what we all love most away from us, and derive much pleasure from our pain.

    M. narcissists affect future generations too. There is constant splitting off of family members - golden children, flying monkeys (apathetic) and scapegoats, affecting the offspring and the offspring's offspring. One of the red flags that we are dealing with MN in our FOO is the absolute silence we get. I mean, if it was my child going NC, I would go to therapy, write them letters, and ask my siblings, their aunts and uncles, to reach out to my child. I would be in my mid-70,s then, and would want my child to have family support when I was gone, That's a normal, motherly response. What we get is a wall of silence and solidarity with our NARCs. That alone should be very telling as to what we are all dealing with.

    It is painful Peep b/c they took away what you most loved and long for - family. The only way to avoid that is be robotic around them, something I saw my one brother master so well. He kept his life very private. By the time we wise up to what we're dealing with, they already figured out how we tick, and then go in for the kill every time.

    I see the homeless begging on the street in NYC daily. It always rips your heart out b/c we live in one of the richest countries in the world. On Thanksgiving day, we walked on 5th Ave, and outside of Louis Vuitton was a middle-aged women with a golf ball size infection in her mouth. That image still haunts me now. I wonder were they scapegoats in their family too.

    I'm at the mercy of my husband. He and my children are my only family left. If he wanted a new wife down the road, I would be such a mess b/c of the PTSD and trust issues I have today. When we walked past that woman, I kept turning around, and he said, "do you see yourself." I know it's by the grace of God that I'm not on the streets. This is what our NM FOO want for us, as the man in the video addresses - they send us out alone and vulnerable.

    One of my last emails to my NS, 3 1/2 yrs ago, was me calling her out on her lies and 2-face behavior, discussing only facts of the matter - no name calling. She responded by more lying and more denying reality, then wrote something that chilled me to the bone to this day, She wrote, "You are going to end up all alone."

    1. I feel for TW seeing her mother years later smirking at her. I don't live in my mother's town so my chances of running into her are pretty remote but yes that would creep me out big time.

      Yes the evil smirks are crazy. I've had nightmares about the last one I saw and of course there is the one I took of her smirking at me in Chicago.

      Yes some of those party throwers can be the biggest narcs. My mother does the grand party productions for the family. Last year she held a fancy restaurant dinner for the entire family. Even if I had been in contact then, I was NC by then, I wouldn't have been able to go, they always had this affair the time of year I could not go which said a lot to me. My NS doesn't bother with charm or parties but maybe that could change as she grows older. She is a different sort of narc, my NM works harder on the appearances but then my NS always had her needs met.

      Yes I can see her hosting your brother's wedding and using it for control never saying a nice word. They will do things to look nice while working actively to destroy people. Mine helped me out in my 30s with some car related stuff so she could appear blameless. She could then trash me and label me scum and then say to others, looked I helped her with such and such. She is an ungrateful daughter. They hold out those bennies to entrap you. Yes they fool others, and do so WELL. I know mine has worked on getting people to love her, even just to keep some away from me. I noticed a fast turn around with my mother and one niece, after I went NC, this niece told me how much time she spent visiting my mother, how she was her Confirmation counselor etc.

      I know mine used charm on others and would be extremely kind and nice to them while giving me a stink eye, sometimes within the same moment.

      They use people and yes do sic them on the scapegoats. I know they love taking things away and enjoy it. It woke me up to see that my mother enjoyed my pain.

      Yes sadly you see the future generations being set up. I can tell already who are the likely candidates for scapegoats. The one uncle [an apathetic lost boy uncle from my mother's FOO] has three grown children who are all over 25 years of age, 25, 26, 27-28 who have never left home. Their career prospects are limited. Their father was a factory worker, even the one that got to college can't get a job. I find it interesting how the rich ones aren't lifting a finger to help them get a foot in the door, and I noted from my brother already they are the new scapegoats, already being called "lazy", "loser", "bums" by my mother. The USA economy has made it worse for many scapegoats. My mother used to have the boys in the group even in their early to mid 20s come to her house to do heavy yard work. My brother was calling them bums the other day, "How come they haven't moved out of the house yet?" I said to him, "The jobs are crummy" and then added, "How come all the rich and connected relatives don't help them get a mail room job or something?" and it shut him up. He doesn't even wake up to the fact he was betrayed too, my mother knows some big bucks people, and I still remember her best friend, one of the heads of a department state of Education who refused to help me find a teaching job when I was fully credentialed and had my juvenile home art teaching job for a few years.


    2. can see the future narcs already too. You can already see that certain smug look of satisfaction on some of their faces and ones who seem to center their entire lives around pleasing their parents.

      I saw a major difference in how my NM treated my brother's children compare to my sisters, far more visits, more presents. The favoritism goes down the generations.

      You are right about the silence, we get, so so right. When I went NC, and I did it with many people in the family, not one wrote back to say, "What is wrong?". They remained silent and said NOTHING. None even raised the issue. Yes a normal family if this happened you would making some attempt. I never heard from my mother's husband either, and that kind of hurt. I had no way to contact him without her in the mix. I could see her opening letters etc, but then he was already serving an enabling role. All seem to act like I am in the wrong. My sister of course gave me the "our mother is blameless" nonsense as I wrote about last week.

      So yes we get the wall of silence and solidarity with the Narcs. That is the thing that can hurt. I have woken up before and had that time of night where you start thinking about stuff and I have thought, "How come I didn't get one ally?" It helps me knowing that has happened to others.

      It is painful. I told a close friend of mine, it is basically like having a family die in a big airplane crash but even then I see my friends on FB who have lost parents and family members and the fond memories they have of their love and connection and I have none of that. [I have some with the Aunt That Loved me, but they were working on her big time as I grew into my teens, and I feared even that relationship being destroyed]

      Yes I did the robotic thing too while LC, but really you just become strangers to each other. One has to keep their life private around narcs, any vulnerability they go on attack.


    3. I am sorry to hear about the homeless begging there. I have almost been homeless and live one echelon above the streets. Let's just say if the government ever did away with social security, I would have to depend on my friends or church to rescue me from the streets. I have had homeless friends in my old town who lied in campers. It rips my heart out too. So many suffering. I will pray for that middle aged woman. In rural areas where I have lived there is a lot of what is called "hidden homeless" these are people who go out to tent cities, or surf couches, or live in people's sheds or barns. I bet they are scapegoats. I have read some literature that seems negative to the homeless claiming most are substance abusers who "burned all their bridges" but how many were scapegoats maligned to their whole families, who grew up lacking skills and confidence or having health destroyed by abusive narcissistic parents, I remember quite a few of them. I had to do the rented room and board housing route right about the streets during my 20s. I have friends helping me out now with food and other things on occasion and sometimes it is hard. I think of those people too, some who may be friendless even out there alone with the hard cruel world. One thing about this world is this is a tough tough place for those who have no kin folk. I think God I got married because I know without him I would not have been able to even stay alive.

      I'm at the mercy of my husband too, so trust me I understand. Friends you do not want to burden. My husband has health problems and hasn't had a normal job in years, so I have to admit having the wolf on our door so long it's been hard. He probably saw the look on your face to see that woman. I and my husband had the discussion where I told him due to our problems I am being triggered back to Chicago and fear it all collapsing again. I don't have the health to bear it all. At least with social security if the system is intact I should not have to bear homelessness, they know I would not survive the streets one night and the social workers, and rest would most likely help but I don't take much for granted. Chances are I will be having husband and I move into disabled housing within the next 5 years unless his job prospects improve. Anything can happen and people need and want families to help support them. During my life I turned to a close church family in my last town to fill the gaps where a family would have been for most people. This may be happening with a new church family though I wish I was more in the place to give to them instead of the other way around. This is a loss too, this feeling of no belonging in the world. The loss of moorings. The sad thing is the narcs who don't even care about anyone get the most people, it is disturbing.

      I know mine wants me alone and vulnerable too.

      Your NS sounds just like mine....Sigh, I feel for you....that is the cruelest thing she could have said. I actually heard that one from my brother, but in a different form, "You must want everyone to ostracize you" because I wasn't staying in scapegoat line.

      I had a year where I ended up all alone. It was during my first NC. My college friends had moved away and I only could talk to them on the phone. I had not met my husband yet, though that was coming very soon. I remember sitting in my apartment on days off on work, and thinking, "I am all alone" and essentially I was. I didn't even have God to pray to then. I remember the fear inside me. Human beings are social animals, this definitely is the worse thing they do to us.