I had a new revelation recently, concerning the relationship with my cousins. As you all know, I am now no contact with the entire family. Part of the reason I am writing this too is to remind myself that contact with the cousins is not good for me either and why. I felt a lot of loss that Queen Spider got to them too.
I was talking to another ACON blogger when it hit me. They projected guilt on me constantly. When I would contact them, they often were too busy or dismissive as well. These are not people I bothered all the time, I would write them on email or Facebook PM, at most three times a year, and more often only once or twice a year. I live 250 miles away, these are not people I am calling crying about my problems, or to change a lightbulb or for asking any favors.
With one cousin, I realized how why and how he made me uncomfortable. When I talked to him, I noticed always how everything remained "my fault", everyone else even of the most worse offenses I pointed out, was always blameless while I was always at fault. I supposedly was a bad person for making them feel bad. He would admit that my mother treated me badly, but that's the furthest any relative went. However he followed my mother's bidding in the way, that if I made people feel "bad" or "guilty" that was to be projected back on me.
He wrote me these things:
"However I think your feelings make people uncomfortable sometimes - and they might invalidate you to maintain their own "reality" (with a small r.)"
and
"I know I've felt guilty in the past for not getting back to you. And feeling guilty is unpleasant, and it's human nature to go into a place of avoidance (i.e. I don't want to contact [my name here--Fivehundredpoundpeep] because I feel bad about not getting back to her, and I don't want to feel bad, so I'll just put it out of my mind.....}
That's a cycle I've tried to become mindful of in myself, and face head on (at least sometimes)"
I have felt "bad" over the no contact with the cousins, but then I see why I had to do it. There was no rescuing these relationships either. I tried.
Even within these relationships, I was always at fault. He even managed to project his own feelings of guilt on me like they were "my fault". I made people feel "guilty" and gave them "negative feelings". For what? Just existing? Writing them once in a blue moon? He projected his guilt on to me.
I made some crack back, at least he felt feelings of guilt unlike sociopaths in the family, but then I should have told him DEAL WITH YOUR GUILT, DON'T PROJECT IT ON ME! Maybe you have something to feel guilty about! Even with the line about my feelings making people uncomfortable, he basically is being honest about the family choice to invalidate me, lest I be an affront to their reality!
"they might invalidate you to maintain their own reality."
ReplyDeleteYeah, at least he's being somewhat honest. Though, "their own reality" sounds like a fluffy way of saying everyone is in denial. Some people are so deep in denial that it becomes their comfort zone; a place where they retreat and self-medicate with delusions. Asking someone deep in denial to face reality, is like taking an alcoholics booze away. They don't like it and they will put up a fight.
Yeah, the narcs and their cohorts project everything onto us. We are the human waste depository for all of their faults, failings and bad acts. I once caught a narcissist in a lie, and then was blamed me for making him lie. LOL. Their projections always reveal what they are trying to hide about themselves. There was this commenter on my blog who always said, "It's funny how narcissists tell on themselves."
Yeah that is a sentence where he tells some truth but sadly it was telling me I was to blame for telling Aunt Denial, she was treating me bad. Yeah the "own reality" thing is a fluffy way to say no one's got reality in check which is a more indirect wa to gas light. He seemed pretty defensive of these comfort zones, like I was a bull in a china shop and needed to go be quiet.
DeleteYeah I realized with all of them, I was always going to be at fault, and no matter what I did or said, it would "be wrong" because my mother said so. There's a point you just don't want to try anymore and are sick of being the human waste depository. I'm not surprised one blamed you for "making him lie". This whole conversation with the cousin was basically "How dare you question anything and "make" people feel guilty!" Yes the narcissists do tell on themselves. If this is the "nicest" one so willing to project on me and make me out to be the monster who "brings bad feelings and guilt" I had no chance at all with that family. It's good I walked.
Yeah, it's sickening - you get treated horribly and then you get treated horribly for existing and reminding people of how horribly you were treated. Why does that cousin even care about your mother's approval or buying into her reality, it's not like his world would come crashing down if he were accept full on reality. and yes, there's an emotional cost to people when they have to face the terrible things that are done to people, but why dont they realize the emotional cost they pay to pretend everything is good when it isnt? i thnk a huge amount of emotional and physical enegy gets spent by polyanna types to push reality aside.
ReplyDeleteYeah it's horrible. I realized anything I had to say to him was "wrong", really no matter what it was, and I had this problem with his brother too. It's one reason I just had to walk. There was nothing positive to be had, because they just saw me through this prism. The entire family revolves around my mother, even the cousins, it's really hard to explain. She visits them a lot too. And all of them want her approval. With these cousins I got narc uncle too who visits them all the time--their uncle too. Honestly all the obedience she musters is maddening, in this cousin's case, he has his own very high paying IT job, so doesn't need her money but he is as submissive to her, as the one cousin who had his trucking school paid for by my mother. They ignore emotional costs, they just want things easy. I notice how all of them focus on deadening emotions. They don't question this either, and that always made me uneasy around them. With those types there is no dealing with reality. When I see Polly-Anna types I run, I'm only going to have boring conversations with them anyway, and they are always lecturing people on weight loss, and they all love their bubble of delusion.
DeleteDear Peeps, Boring conversations! You can type that again. Sometimes i just want to bang my head against a wall. About a month ago, had company (who chose not to take a hint - i was in the middle of something) . This person went on and on and on...with the usual ...yawn, sprinkled with arrogant language (picture a match-box car contending with a sherman tank). The conversation always devolves into her glory days. Gag me with a fork! Does she even consider her boyfriend's feelings? Of course nnootttt! Ugh!
ReplyDeleteYeah it sucks doesn't it Sue, I try to meet people and it's hard. Even if I could escape the "making face" crowd, it'd be a lot better. Yeah the bragging and glory days get old. The boyfriend was probably busy tuning her out!
DeleteFamilies that don't respond to abuse typically end up with splintered families. If you go "no contact" then NM will invariably pick one of your siblings to be the new scapegoat. She'll see exactly what you went through and that builds a bond of understanding between the two of you.
ReplyDeleteNMs, especially the malignant brands, go through all of their children until only one golden child is left.
When people marry into the family, they don't like the toxicity either, especially if they are from normal families. Then they too become part of the "scapegoat team."
Breaking contact is often the best way for the dominoes to fall in place.
I agree they end up splintered. I have heard that another sibling will become the scapegoat, I think I went NC too late to have that happen and end up with a bond with a sibling. My GC sister is too much like her in personality holding the same sociopathic traits. My brother likes her money and still bows to her to get it, but lives very far away and I noticed before I went no contact with him bonded with his girlfriend's family as "his". She may pick someone closer, maybe even a non-relative? Yes some people can escape and then end up with a scapegoat on their team. My mother was high end one, she trashed my brother's ex wife, I believe even caused their divorce in many ways, but even there she managed to smear me enough where the potential ally was turned against me. I am not sure. Definitely with me out of the picture it will be changing things. Sadly the family is impacted by multiple narcissists not just one. I have to admit too much water has passed under the bridge for me. I am sure some spouses got some unwelcomed surprises marrying into the family.
Delete"Sadly the family is impacted by multiple narcissists not just one." -- that is typical because it is a "see monkey do" kind of dynamic.
DeleteAnd sometimes the only bond left of the original family is the narcissists. You can imagine those cat fights and blaming sessions.
Meanwhile, we don't have to listen to it any more. We aren't obsessed with defending ourselves. We've left the battlefield. The only way a narcissist feels he has won is when someone is on the battlefield getting caught in the argument and defending themselves.
I believe leaving the battlefield shows a lot more strength than what they do.
Yes I didn't just have one or two to deal with but multiple ones. They were all very much alike, there were some coverts in the mix too. That's interesting you mention that the only bond left of the original family is the narcissists, I can see that in mine, those were the ones who visited each other the most. I'm glad to be away from the cat fights, competition and blame sessions. I think leaving them all, when was that last spring? I cut off ANY contact with even the most remote relative, definitely broke me of the trap of defending myself. I got caught too long in that hoping to find allies. Yeah we left the battlefield and walked. Thanks for saying leaving the battlefield shows more strength. You are right they got to believe they've won over the ones they keep in the combat.
DeleteYes I didn't just have one or two to deal with but multiple ones. They were all very much alike, there were some coverts in the mix too. That's interesting you mention that the only bond left of the original family is the narcissists, I can see that in mine, those were the ones who visited each other the most. I'm glad to be away from the cat fights, competition and blame sessions. I think leaving them all, when was that last spring? I cut off ANY contact with even the most remote relative, definitely broke me of the trap of defending myself. I got caught too long in that hoping to find allies. Yeah we left the battlefield and walked. Thanks for saying leaving the battlefield shows more strength. You are right they got to believe they've won over the ones they keep in the combat.
DeleteNo contact since Spring -- you are still probably in throws of grieving stages.
ReplyDeleteIt gets better.
I am four years into it and counting.
One of the things that helped me a lot was going to survivor groups. It takes a lot of effort just to feel motivated, and most ACONs want to isolate, but I made myself do it. When we don't have a family, we have to make our own. Human beings are social animals, and if we aren't engaged socially, the pain will fester. The thing about survivor groups is that the people in them have all been through what we have been through, so examining them for trustworthiness is not as all-important, I have found.
The other thing that helped me was art and writing. Just drawing and making cartoons out of the absurd things that narcissists say to manipulate us and blame us (all of the tricks they try on us) looks ridiculous on paper. I find that "intellectualizing" toxic experiences takes the experience out of me and puts it into something inanimate.
In trauma therapy you state the experience in a way that puts the experience in another context, and the context is supposed to heal you and help you from experiencing it in your mind and heart. Don't let the toxic arrows in your heart.
By deflecting arrows and putting them on paper, the paper owns them now (in a way). It worked for me.
Also, narcissists hate exposure, and the more light they have to endure, the less powerful they feel.
Yeah the rest of the family was last May, main narcs 4 and half years, but I went no contact from one friend of 30 years last July so there has been grieving stages. So many people too shaking my head.
DeleteI am glad you found survivor groups Lise, I tried to find adult children of abuse and the like locally and was unable to. I left the depression/self help group because it started focusing only on people with bipolar--good but that does not apply to me, and really I didn't relate to their lives, most had close knit families though there was a few exceptions. I agree about making ones own family. Outside of husband and online friends I have become extremely isolated. It is a major problem and I am not sure how to fix it. I tried classes etc. I did start attended a new small UU fellowship but now struggling with weather keeping me home, so that's just been one visit. The people are friendly there so I have some hopes but I know it's something I have to work on.
I am glad you have had IRL survivor groups, that is great.
So glad you had your writing and drawing, I always enjoyed your art and thought it was great. :) You really say in art works like drawing the queen and the scapegoat what really needs to say. You will notice I did my own comics. The family appears in the series but there many other things too. Yes it does look ridiculous on paper and even rereading one's journals. Agree about letting the paper own things. Doing the zines did help me too. I have 20 journals of comics. These comics I picked were a smattering over view, I could do far more. I had to edit down even for sake of copying costs. It does seem doing your art work helped too. Art for me was a healing place to go for many years, I am sure that was one motivating factor for it. Agree they do hate exposure and with the rest.
That sounds wonderful -- your new comics! I want to purchase in the new year! I support you in this. Yes, doing art work on the issues helps.
DeleteThat sounds wonderful -- your new comics! I want to purchase in the new year! I support you in this. Yes, doing art work on the issues helps.
DeleteBTW, did Lisette take down her blog, or is it just in sleep mode for awhile? Such a good blog it was "House of Mirrors".
ReplyDeleteI hope it's not taken down for good and is just temporary. I think it was a good blog too, I read it some time before I started writing about ACON issues here. It helped me a lot.
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